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Felt the back slipping out - few questions

  #1  
Old 07-07-2011, 03:08 PM
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Default Felt the back slipping out - few questions

I hit a right hand turn today that was posted at 15 and probably hit it at 30. Ive done this turn a few times before and never had any problems but on this one I felt the back slipping out an my toe dragged on the ground. Needless to say I freaked out haha I thought I was going over for sure. I have a few questions...

1. What should my foot position be when riding? I read somewhere that you should always be on the ***** of your feet. I usually ride more in the middle of my feet so I am closer to the shifter and the brake. What should I do here?

2. Where to place weight around a turn. I read that placing weight on the outside turning foot is best. For example on a right hand turn I should place weight on my left foot. Is this right?

3. Where to place body on turns? I think I had too much weight on the front end of the bike and thats why the back started to slip out.

4. Clutch in or out around turns? I usually ride twisties in 2nd gear at around 7-9k RPM. Is this okay? I feel like this takes more weight off the back of the bike and could cause it to slip out.

Please give me some tips guys I am not trying to go down haha.

EDIT: Tires are in good shape
 
  #2  
Old 07-10-2011, 01:34 AM
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Had a long post replying here... then hit the back button (I blame Rum & Cokes).
  • You should be on the ***** of your feet, with the inside foot tucked in.
    You have already figured out one reason (foot draggin). You also don't want to make any accidental inputs with your foot so close to the control levers. Or get a foot stuck under one. Another reason is you want to grip the tank with your knees to prevent shifting all over the bike due to g-forces. When on the ***** of your feet, your legs will bend more naturally and place your knees higher up
  • Weight placement is all part of the balancing act. Honestly for everyday riding, weighting the pegs is almost unnecessary. It helps in some situations, like counter-balancing during slow turns. But it is something you can ignore for the moment until you get the basics down. Generally though, you want to "weight" the outside peg. I don't know that doing so significantly affects the center of gravity. I do know that it helps me to maintain my position and seating
  • Body placement takes up whole chapters in riding books. It's not something to answer in a quick reply to someone trying to learn and understand the basics. It's best covered on a track with an instructor or with a good riding book. I doubt seriously though your body placement had anything to do with the rear slipping. More likely is a lack of throttle control and failure to maintain a good front / rear weight ratio with maintenance throttle. I say this because until you're trying to shave seconds and halves of seconds off your turns on a track, you can actually make most turns sitting almost bolt straight up in the saddle. "Hanging off" helps you to reduce the bike's lean angle, allowing you to take turns faster due to more traction being availible.
  • You shouldn't be "freewheeling" through a turn. You need maintenance throttle to maintain the front - rear weight ratio to provide traction from the rear tire. https://cbrforum.com/forum/street-sk...9/#post1076951
 
  #3  
Old 07-20-2011, 03:27 PM
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It may have been road debris- I've felt mine slip on what looked like a clean surface that turned out to have dirty sand. Couldn't see it till I came back through slow.
 
  #4  
Old 07-20-2011, 05:05 PM
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"Couldn't see it till I came back through slow", This is the reason for scouting before sporting. You don't ride hot till you've examined the course. That's true on or off the track. Look first and plan for the variables is the smart way to play the game.

Don't try for max speed on the first pass, note it and try INCREMENTAL speed increases. Remember you get the most points for not crashing in the street game.
Don't confuse street riding with sport riding. Street riding is how you get to sport rides. Avoid the "beat-every-corner" mentality for every day commutes, practise SMOOTH. That's what will make you fast.

When you want to sport ride, pick a 2-5 mile section of un-populated street (your milage may varie), slow-roll it. Look at the angles, radiuii, debris/potholes for that stretch, fix it in your mind. THEN go back to the start and pick-up the pace.

Run that stretch a couple of times, paying attention to your speed. If you know how fast you were going, you can gradually increasing it. At first don't run that stretch backwards at speed), it will only confuse you (Hallett Raceway quit reversing the track direction for afternoon runs on trackdays, too many crashes. Learn that section, and keep coming back to it.

Don't try going all out on an unfamiler road. That way lies madness and pain. The reason that trackers get those insane speeds... the course doesn't change! They memorize it and the speed/positioning for the perfect run on that course.

One note, regarding the nature of this post. Always keep other drivers in mind when
on public roads!! I always regard my side of the line as the ONLY "track" available. If you cross into the on-coming lane, at any time, you lose points (major points and possibly your life!!). The streets are NOT a race-track. You should never push the bike to it's/your's absolute limit. Always hold back a reserve for that "OHhh, SHOOT!!" moment, because it WILL happen. No one wants you to be injured or killed, "Where's the fun in that?".

I advocate using every moment of saddle time to improving your skills, but you don't have to red-line a bike on the street to do that. Focus on smooth, firm control of the bike, you'll be glad you did.

Ern
 
  #5  
Old 12-12-2011, 08:41 PM
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all great advice for sure. I like to get into a low enough gear that I keep a load on my back wheel as I enter the corner but be careful that you don't drop into too low of a gear as you will upset the stability of the bike. It is fully possible that you just caught a little debris so don't worry too much about it. The more time you spend on the bike the more comfortable you will get.
 
  #6  
Old 12-13-2011, 07:19 PM
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+1 Hatter and Kuroshio.
ok - you mention lower gear(2nd or 3rd) at 7-9K? That is around max torque on any of them. Is it possible that in the lower gear you gave too much trottle in the lean and lost traction? Just a thought..... last a posted 15 curve at 30. Now I do that, double the posted limit sometimes when I know the ** isolated** road. Around here in the mountains I have found the posted limits can be a VERY good suggestion :-) especially if you don't know the road.
 
  #7  
Old 12-13-2011, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by MadHattr059 View Post
"Couldn't see it till I came back through slow", This is the reason for scouting before sporting. You don't ride hot till you've examined the course. That's true on or off the track. Look first and plan for the variables is the smart way to play the game.

Don't try for max speed on the first pass, note it and try INCREMENTAL speed increases. Remember you get the most points for not crashing in the street game.
Don't confuse street riding with sport riding. Street riding is how you get to sport rides. Avoid the "beat-every-corner" mentality for every day commutes, practise SMOOTH. That's what will make you fast.

When you want to sport ride, pick a 2-5 mile section of un-populated street (your milage may varie), slow-roll it. Look at the angles, radiuii, debris/potholes for that stretch, fix it in your mind. THEN go back to the start and pick-up the pace.

Run that stretch a couple of times, paying attention to your speed. If you know how fast you were going, you can gradually increasing it. At first don't run that stretch backwards at speed), it will only confuse you (Hallett Raceway quit reversing the track direction for afternoon runs on trackdays, too many crashes. Learn that section, and keep coming back to it.

Don't try going all out on an unfamiler road. That way lies madness and pain. The reason that trackers get those insane speeds... the course doesn't change! They memorize it and the speed/positioning for the perfect run on that course.

One note, regarding the nature of this post. Always keep other drivers in mind when
on public roads!! I always regard my side of the line as the ONLY "track" available. If you cross into the on-coming lane, at any time, you lose points (major points and possibly your life!!). The streets are NOT a race-track. You should never push the bike to it's/your's absolute limit. Always hold back a reserve for that "OHhh, SHOOT!!" moment, because it WILL happen. No one wants you to be injured or killed, "Where's the fun in that?".

I advocate using every moment of saddle time to improving your skills, but you don't have to red-line a bike on the street to do that. Focus on smooth, firm control of the bike, you'll be glad you did.

Ern
If your gonna do stuff like that on the street, listen to this guys advice. Notice what he says, "it WILL happen." Enjoy yourself as much you can, but I GUARANTEE, you will go down if you continue to do this on the street; way too many variables: dirt, dust, road grime, oil, sand, on-coming traffic, cops, pedestrians, wind, hardware, and anything else that can ever be on a public street. I have personally lost more friends than I like to think about from driving on the edge of their seats. Its better dead than dribbling at the mouth in a wheelchair like my best friend. Dress in all leathers, and go to a track; at least this way, you expect to go down, and wont hit kids while your at it.
 
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