Some feedback needed on braking??
#21
03-16-2008, 11:04 PM
RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
On a sportbike the front brake provides much more of the braking than the rear. Even skillfull application of the rear shortens the stopping distance by a small amount, and accident analysis shows the rear is usually locked, contributing to the accident. If you are seriously trying to slow down, dont even think about downshifting; even with a slipper clutch, rear slide is likely, and guaranteed if the rear brake is used. Pull the clutch in when you are hard on the brake!!
The problem with the rear brake on sportbikes is that the rear tire contact patch decreases with increased braking force, you must decrease rear brake pressure as you get the suspension weighted forward or you will slide.
As you slow, try to grip the tank with your knees instead of just leaning on the handlebars. This will keep some weight back towards the rear, you'll be able to squeeze the front brake harder without locking the front tire or bottoming the forks.
Considering how hard it is to modulate the rear brake without skidding, it's understandable why many riders prefer to avoid it alltogather.
Racers dragging the anchors as hard as they can usually just let the rear tire rise until it just skims along the road to provide directional stability, then back off the front brake when they start to lean.
Stopping in a hurry and changing directions quickly are life saving skills every rider should practice
The problem with the rear brake on sportbikes is that the rear tire contact patch decreases with increased braking force, you must decrease rear brake pressure as you get the suspension weighted forward or you will slide.
As you slow, try to grip the tank with your knees instead of just leaning on the handlebars. This will keep some weight back towards the rear, you'll be able to squeeze the front brake harder without locking the front tire or bottoming the forks.
Considering how hard it is to modulate the rear brake without skidding, it's understandable why many riders prefer to avoid it alltogather.
Racers dragging the anchors as hard as they can usually just let the rear tire rise until it just skims along the road to provide directional stability, then back off the front brake when they start to lean.
Stopping in a hurry and changing directions quickly are life saving skills every rider should practice
#22
03-16-2008, 11:52 PM
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RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
ORIGINAL: Sonomajay
On a sportbike the front brake provides much more of the braking than the rear. Even skillfull application of the rear shortens the stopping distance by a small amount, and accident analysis shows the rear is usually locked, contributing to the accident. If you are seriously trying to slow down, dont even think about downshifting; even with a slipper clutch, rear slide is likely, and guaranteed if the rear brake is used. Pull the clutch in when you are hard on the brake!!
The problem with the rear brake on sportbikes is that the rear tire contact patch decreases with increased braking force, you must decrease rear brake pressure as you get the suspension weighted forward or you will slide.
As you slow, try to grip the tank with your knees instead of just leaning on the handlebars. This will keep some weight back towards the rear, you'll be able to squeeze the front brake harder without locking the front tire or bottoming the forks.
Considering how hard it is to modulate the rear brake without skidding, it's understandable why many riders prefer to avoid it alltogather.
Racers dragging the anchors as hard as they can usually just let the rear tire rise until it just skims along the road to provide directional stability, then back off the front brake when they start to lean.
Stopping in a hurry and changing directions quickly are life saving skills every rider should practice
On a sportbike the front brake provides much more of the braking than the rear. Even skillfull application of the rear shortens the stopping distance by a small amount, and accident analysis shows the rear is usually locked, contributing to the accident. If you are seriously trying to slow down, dont even think about downshifting; even with a slipper clutch, rear slide is likely, and guaranteed if the rear brake is used. Pull the clutch in when you are hard on the brake!!
The problem with the rear brake on sportbikes is that the rear tire contact patch decreases with increased braking force, you must decrease rear brake pressure as you get the suspension weighted forward or you will slide.
As you slow, try to grip the tank with your knees instead of just leaning on the handlebars. This will keep some weight back towards the rear, you'll be able to squeeze the front brake harder without locking the front tire or bottoming the forks.
Considering how hard it is to modulate the rear brake without skidding, it's understandable why many riders prefer to avoid it alltogather.
Racers dragging the anchors as hard as they can usually just let the rear tire rise until it just skims along the road to provide directional stability, then back off the front brake when they start to lean.
Stopping in a hurry and changing directions quickly are life saving skills every rider should practice
And what are anchors?
I like this input...it's got some meat on it. Thanks!
There you go, after some input i have a different perspective on braking. Now, i just need some more practice.
#23
03-17-2008, 12:52 AM
RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
Anchors=slang for braking really hard.
As far as the the clutch and braking, downshifting and engine braking are fun and useful in many situations, but if maximal braking are the goal, ie panic stops and slowing for a 30 mph corner after a 130 mph straight, then you are going to pull in the clutch as you actuate the front brake. In a panic stop situation, you would keep the clutch in until stopped. If you need to turn instead of stopping, you kick the gearshift down to the appropriate gear, and, right before you lean in, blip the throttle to match revs, ease the clutch out, and ease off the brake.
As far as the the clutch and braking, downshifting and engine braking are fun and useful in many situations, but if maximal braking are the goal, ie panic stops and slowing for a 30 mph corner after a 130 mph straight, then you are going to pull in the clutch as you actuate the front brake. In a panic stop situation, you would keep the clutch in until stopped. If you need to turn instead of stopping, you kick the gearshift down to the appropriate gear, and, right before you lean in, blip the throttle to match revs, ease the clutch out, and ease off the brake.
#24
03-17-2008, 07:26 AM
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RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
+1 ampfp. I try to squeeze the brake slightly till the forks compress a little bit, then apply progressively more pressure on the brake lever. This stops you more quickly then squeezing hard the lever immediately and maybe locking the front wheel(think of an ABS system in your fingers). I learnt this the hard way[:@]. Grabbing the tank with your knees is also fundamental as it keeps in check your weight distribution.Engine braking does more harm than good; brake pads cost less than crank and locking the rear is nerve cracking to say the least. My .02.
#25
03-17-2008, 01:33 PM
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RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
ORIGINAL: Sonomajay
Anchors=slang for braking really hard.
As far as the the clutch and braking, downshifting and engine braking are fun and useful in many situations, but if maximal braking are the goal, ie panic stops and slowing for a 30 mph corner after a 130 mph straight, then you are going to pull in the clutch as you actuate the front brake. In a panic stop situation, you would keep the clutch in until stopped. If you need to turn instead of stopping, you kick the gearshift down to the appropriate gear, and, right before you lean in, blip the throttle to match revs, ease the clutch out, and ease off the brake.
Anchors=slang for braking really hard.
As far as the the clutch and braking, downshifting and engine braking are fun and useful in many situations, but if maximal braking are the goal, ie panic stops and slowing for a 30 mph corner after a 130 mph straight, then you are going to pull in the clutch as you actuate the front brake. In a panic stop situation, you would keep the clutch in until stopped. If you need to turn instead of stopping, you kick the gearshift down to the appropriate gear, and, right before you lean in, blip the throttle to match revs, ease the clutch out, and ease off the brake.
#26
03-17-2008, 01:35 PM
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RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
ORIGINAL: kukku
+1 ampfp. I try to squeeze the brake slightly till the forks compress a little bit, then apply progressively more pressure on the brake lever. This stops you more quickly then squeezing hard the lever immediately and maybe locking the front wheel(think of an ABS system in your fingers). I learnt this the hard way[:@]. Grabbing the tank with your knees is also fundamental as it keeps in check your weight distribution.Engine braking does more harm than good; brake pads cost less than crank and locking the rear is nerve cracking to say the least. My .02.
+1 ampfp. I try to squeeze the brake slightly till the forks compress a little bit, then apply progressively more pressure on the brake lever. This stops you more quickly then squeezing hard the lever immediately and maybe locking the front wheel(think of an ABS system in your fingers). I learnt this the hard way[:@]. Grabbing the tank with your knees is also fundamental as it keeps in check your weight distribution.Engine braking does more harm than good; brake pads cost less than crank and locking the rear is nerve cracking to say the least. My .02.
#27
03-17-2008, 02:11 PM
Senior Member
RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
yea i try to use both everytime (thats what your supposed to do, according to the book) and it works good.
dont hit them abruptly tho, put them on a little then as you start to stop you can squeeze them in very hard and you wont slide but you will stop very fast. thats the exp. ive had so far... but im also not a seasoned pro so i could be wrong
dont hit them abruptly tho, put them on a little then as you start to stop you can squeeze them in very hard and you wont slide but you will stop very fast. thats the exp. ive had so far... but im also not a seasoned pro so i could be wrong
#28
03-17-2008, 02:21 PM
RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
Pulling the brake is like pulling the trigger on a gun. Its a fast squeeze, not a pull, but a squeeze. It is something that pratice will help with. I am a new rider myself.. But I treat the brakes and clutch as a trigger.. All of my panic stops have been controlled and that is even with the rear brake. I have some nice open roads and parking lots where I live, so I go out and practice as much as possible.
#29
03-17-2008, 03:42 PM
Senior Member
RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
There are so many opinions here, I don't know where to start. Sonomojay hit most of the points I was going to bring out, and I think you should listen (and so should some of the other posters who thought it was a good idea to talk about "what they do"). Some of you guys are going to get hurt with some of these dangerous philosophies. Remember to separate technique and philosophy and remember not to get too tied down to doing things one way every time.
One thing I wanted to point out that Sonomojay mentioned is blipping and easing out the clutch...they are two different ways of achieving the same result. If you read Keith Code's articles on the skill of blipping he mentions that easing the clutch is a bad habit formed by those who never learned to blip properly and costs more attention and has other ill-effects.
OTHERWISE- Keep reading, keep posting, and keep riding.
One thing I wanted to point out that Sonomojay mentioned is blipping and easing out the clutch...they are two different ways of achieving the same result. If you read Keith Code's articles on the skill of blipping he mentions that easing the clutch is a bad habit formed by those who never learned to blip properly and costs more attention and has other ill-effects.
OTHERWISE- Keep reading, keep posting, and keep riding.
#30
03-17-2008, 04:06 PM
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RE: Some feedback needed on braking??
ORIGINAL: Jaybird180
There are so many opinions here, I don't know where to start. Sonomojay hit most of the points I was going to bring out, and I think you should listen (and so should some of the other posters who thought it was a good idea to talk about "what they do"). Some of you guys are going to get hurt with some of these dangerous philosophies. Remember to separate technique and philosophy and remember not to get too tied down to doing things one way every time.
One thing I wanted to point out that Sonomojay mentioned is blipping and easing out the clutch...they are two different ways of achieving the same result. If you read Keith Code's articles on the skill of blipping he mentions that easing the clutch is a bad habit formed by those who never learned to blip properly and costs more attention and has other ill-effects.
OTHERWISE- Keep reading, keep posting, and keep riding.
There are so many opinions here, I don't know where to start. Sonomojay hit most of the points I was going to bring out, and I think you should listen (and so should some of the other posters who thought it was a good idea to talk about "what they do"). Some of you guys are going to get hurt with some of these dangerous philosophies. Remember to separate technique and philosophy and remember not to get too tied down to doing things one way every time.
One thing I wanted to point out that Sonomojay mentioned is blipping and easing out the clutch...they are two different ways of achieving the same result. If you read Keith Code's articles on the skill of blipping he mentions that easing the clutch is a bad habit formed by those who never learned to blip properly and costs more attention and has other ill-effects.
OTHERWISE- Keep reading, keep posting, and keep riding.