Have you ever tried a clutchless downshift? You do have to blip the throttle... it's the same as regular downshifting/blipping, just without the clutch. It's especially easy on a slipper clutch, but can be done without. Takes a bit of practice. Learn it ona dirtbike first, and get real comfortable with it, then try it on the F4i.

tbw

edit: I take it back, don't try clutchless downshifting on your F4i. There's really no point. Just a demonstration of principle. Proof of concept, if you will.

 

I'm not very mechanically inclined, but why would Mr. Honda go through the trouble of fitting a clutch in the first place when clutchless shifting is like regular clutch shifting?

 

Try clutchless shifting from Neutral to 1st.

 

Basically what it all comes down to is this:

In any transmission, motorcycle or otherwise, there are certain ranges of the powerband where, depending on what gear you're currently in and what gear you're trying to get to, the gears will mesh well, meaning they're each rotating at an appropriate speed to where little gear synchronization is required. This effect is amplified during acceleration, because you're using the accelerating momentum of the input shaft to help the gears "spin up" to the target speed of the next gear.

Just because it can be done (and rather easily, I might add) doesn't mean you should do it. If you don't do it perfectly everytime (and nobody here is perfect), you will gradually start to wear down the leading and trailing edges of the transmission gear teeth. The guys that clutchless shift all the time are most likely Superstock racers who aren't allowed to use quick shifters due to parent racing body regulations, or higher level racers that just prefer not to run a shift assist module on their setup. Remeber, racers like this have their transmissions rebuilt on a MUCH more regular basis that you and I tootling around on city streets.

It's generally accepted that clutchless upshifting, during acceleration,above the 1/2 to 3/4 powerband (note: not to be done at the top of the powerband because your power curve starts to drop off), doesn't cause any significant damage to leading and trailing transmission gear teeth. When done properly.

It should feel smooth and effortless. The bike will "want" to shift up into that next gear. You'll be able to tell when you're doing it wrong. It's hardest to do from 1st to 2nd gear, because the difference between 1st and 2nd gear ratios is generally more significant on most bikes compared to 3-4, 4-5, and 5-6 gear transitions. Again, GENERALLY speaking. Not all cases are the same.

But this discussion is about power-shifting, which I have no input regarding : )

cheers

the blonde weasel

 

Just so there's no confusion, I'm not advocating clutchless shifting, just trying to explain it. I do not clutchless shift the F4i unless I'm really hard-charging, and only once in a while because it's fun. It seems to happen most often after I've been watching F1 racing :P BWAAAA-BWWAAAAAA-BWAAAAAA!!!

I clutchless shift pretty much all the time when I'm out in the desert (YZ-250). But there's less resistance on the drivetrain due to partial traction in dirt, so it's not exactly the same ballgame.

 

No clutchless shifting for me (at least very rarely) I figure they put a clutch on my bike for a reason. However, I do enjoy clutchless shifting on diesel trucks. That's when you can really feel the vehicle "want" to shift up into the next gear. It will practically pull itself into gear on its own.

 

your logic is backwards.

I only use my clutch when stopped, down shifting, and taking off. Other than that I dont use it and havent had an issue from it, regardless of speed or rpms. Some people just like talking out of their *** to hear themselves talking and think everyone else should think like them. (not aimed at anyone in particular)

 

I'm not here to argue, I'm just stating what I do and my logic behind it. People are more than welcome to **** in their gas tank to up the octane for all I care.

 

gears are always always always meshed...synchronizers must be what you're referring to. not sure why people say "grinding gears" ever...that grinding is the dog collar's teeth on the shaft's splines

semi-trucks and motorcycles are a totally different breed...trucks = no synchros

I regularly shift without the clutch, a simple roll off the throttle and a light pressure to the shifter results in a smooth click into gear up or down. I don't do it under load, usually at cruise when I don't have my left hand on the handlebar. You can do it exactly the same way in a car...I've done it regularly with my $1400 T56 with no trouble. Really have to understand completely how it works and you'll know that it does not hurt anything.

 

only time i personally feel it is needed, is during a drag. just my 2 cent