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Riding Errors

  #1  
Old 04-01-2019, 04:44 PM
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Default Riding Errors

One of the most common errors we see at the California Superbike School with our students riding on track is adding lean angle and throttle at the same time. Why is this a bad thing? How do you ensure that you aren't adding both lean angle and throttle at the same time?
 
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Old 04-01-2019, 05:59 PM
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Just realised Iím sitting with an imaginary pair of floating handle bars trying to replicate adding lean and throttle. Doesnít even work from my sofa !
 

Last edited by wes 17; 04-01-2019 at 06:03 PM.
  #3  
Old 04-01-2019, 09:35 PM
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Please, tell us.
 
  #4  
Old 04-05-2019, 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted by wes 17 View Post
Just realised Iím sitting with an imaginary pair of floating handle bars trying to replicate adding lean and throttle. Doesnít even work from my sofa !
Hahahahah! That's the idea!! Get you to think about your own riding

Well, think about it like this, if you are trying to lean/steer the bike while adding throttle is it going to be easier to get it pointed in the direction you are wanting or harder? What kind of line could it then put you on?
 
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Old 04-05-2019, 06:38 PM
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My lean/steer/throttle positions in a turn are always negotiable even though I will of had a pre determined preference. Adjustments made or not, I am where I want to be and at a suitable speed.
If something unforeseen happens and I have to act, then a fast recalibration of everything is done. If this means adding throttle, then it’s done. It’s been assessed and it’s what I need to do. It puts me where I want to be again for the moment, the line though has altered and it’s back to another lean/steer/ throttle preference. All this before judging the next circumstance.
Kind of progressive thinking.
Its been a while since I’ve done a track day ( getting old) and my reply was thought through from a road perspective sorry.
 
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Old 04-06-2019, 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by wes 17 View Post
My lean/steer/throttle positions in a turn are always negotiable even though I will of had a pre determined preference. Adjustments made or not, I am where I want to be and at a suitable speed.
If something unforeseen happens and I have to act, then a fast recalibration of everything is done. If this means adding throttle, then itís done. Itís been assessed and itís what I need to do. It puts me where I want to be again for the moment, the line though has altered and itís back to another lean/steer/ throttle preference. All this before judging the next circumstance.
Kind of progressive thinking.
Its been a while since Iíve done a track day ( getting old) and my reply was thought through from a road perspective sorry.
Intelligent thoughts and well stated Wes
 
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Old 04-09-2019, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by wes 17 View Post
My lean/steer/throttle positions in a turn are always negotiable even though I will of had a pre determined preference. Adjustments made or not, I am where I want to be and at a suitable speed.
If something unforeseen happens and I have to act, then a fast recalibration of everything is done. If this means adding throttle, then itís done. Itís been assessed and itís what I need to do. It puts me where I want to be again for the moment, the line though has altered and itís back to another lean/steer/ throttle preference. All this before judging the next circumstance.
Kind of progressive thinking.
Its been a while since Iíve done a track day ( getting old) and my reply was thought through from a road perspective sorry.
Totally get that you want to be adaptable when riding to accommodate for anything unforeseen and that is great. However, what I'm getting at here is learning proper technique so that you reduce the chances that you will have to make mid corner corrections (baring emergency maneuvers or whatever)....What I mean by that is that as a riding coach I see many students making the common error of trying to turn their bikes while the gas is already on and/or adding lean angle and gas at the same time. When this happens, it tends to put riders on a line that is wider at the exit then necessary or then they maybe expected and THEN they need to make corrections by adding more lean angle (and if you are at or near max lean or try and add lean while continuing to roll on the gas you can overload the tires and low side.) Running wide in itself is especially dangerous considering it can put you into oncoming traffic or cause you to make dangerous adjustments.

So while I agree that you need to be somewhat open and flexible to dealing with unforeseen situations on the fly, I think in general you can rid yourself of bad riding habits by eliminating the idea of adding lean angle and gas at the same time....So what do you do instead? How do you ensure that you get the timing of your throttle control correct?
 
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Old 04-10-2019, 03:03 AM
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Good topic this is something I've been struggling with on and off

The good thing is I recognize that I'm doing it, usually it happens when I mid corner start to think I need to make a tighter turn than when I first set up my lean and entered the corner. Sometimes because I slightly misjudged the tightness of the corner with regard to my speed, and sometimes I just "chicken out" because I psyched myself into thinking I might go wide so "better go tighter just in case" when I really did not have to, which is terrible I know and I end up apexing too early too. Been working on it though

In addition to what Misti already mentioned, I think I also read somewhere that adding lean while adding throttle is also adding more acceleration than usual because the radius of the wheel touching the ground slightly decreases as you lean more

All considered it does not seem ideal technique to add too much lean and throttle at the same time. (obviously in an emergency street riding situation you do what you can) Any specific exercises to stop this becoming a habit, and (ideally) make a good line to begin with that doesnt require changes mid corner? Also for cases where the bike does need to be unexpectedly leaned more mid corner (because life isnt perfect sometimes) what is the proper thing to do with the throttle? Continue gently roll on?hold steady? Very gently decel before continuing roll on? Hmm
 
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Old 04-17-2019, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by SunBlue View Post
Good topic this is something I've been struggling with on and off

The good thing is I recognize that I'm doing it, usually it happens when I mid corner start to think I need to make a tighter turn than when I first set up my lean and entered the corner. Sometimes because I slightly misjudged the tightness of the corner with regard to my speed, and sometimes I just "chicken out" because I psyched myself into thinking I might go wide so "better go tighter just in case" when I really did not have to, which is terrible I know and I end up apexing too early too. Been working on it though

In addition to what Misti already mentioned, I think I also read somewhere that adding lean while adding throttle is also adding more acceleration than usual because the radius of the wheel touching the ground slightly decreases as you lean more

All considered it does not seem ideal technique to add too much lean and throttle at the same time. (obviously in an emergency street riding situation you do what you can) Any specific exercises to stop this becoming a habit, and (ideally) make a good line to begin with that doesnt require changes mid corner? Also for cases where the bike does need to be unexpectedly leaned more mid corner (because life isnt perfect sometimes) what is the proper thing to do with the throttle? Continue gently roll on?hold steady? Very gently decel before continuing roll on? Hmm
Lots to think about hey!! So yes, it is not ideal technique to add lean and gas at the same time. We have students consciously think about getting the bike turned, pointed in the direction they want to go and THEN adding the throttle. Steer. Line. Gas.

As for picking a good line to start with? What makes a good line? If you find yourself apexing too early and running wide at the exit, what does that mean you did at the turn entry? Did you turn too early (or too far to the inside), just right or too late? (I'll look at the other questions a bit later, once this is addressed)
 
  #10  
Old 04-17-2019, 12:38 PM
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I think that picking a good line really takes getting to know your corner. I always late apex as it's better to not run wide on the exit. Then bring the apex earlier a little at a time so the exit is right where it needs to be. Since I mostly ride in canyons,and not on a track, late apex is just safer. Running wide could be fatal....
 
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