riding questions
#21
05-23-2008 | 09:59 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,421
Likes: 0
From:
RE: riding questions
Most riders are right-hand shy. This is because vision is usually more limited for right hand turns, and because the right hand is used to control the throttle. Chopping the throttle is a bad idea in almost any situation, but especially during a lean. Chopping upsets the suspension, which could cause your rubber to lose grip on pavement = ouch!
As always, I recommend reading Total Control by Lee Parks. Awesome book, and has tons of drills to improve your riding skills.
And VooDoo, I don't think practice is boring! Any time spent in the saddle is fun time for me!
As always, I recommend reading Total Control by Lee Parks. Awesome book, and has tons of drills to improve your riding skills.
And VooDoo, I don't think practice is boring! Any time spent in the saddle is fun time for me!
#22
05-23-2008 | 10:04 AM
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,127
Likes: 10
From: United Kindgdom
RE: riding questions
ORIGINAL: TennesseeCBRF2
Most riders are right-hand shy. This is because vision is usually more limited for right hand turns, and because the right hand is used to control the throttle. Chopping the throttle is a bad idea in almost any situation, but especially during a lean. Chopping upsets the suspension, which could cause your rubber to lose grip on pavement = ouch!
As always, I recommend reading Total Control by Lee Parks. Awesome book, and has tons of drills to improve your riding skills.
And VooDoo, I don't think practice is boring! Any time spent in the saddle is fun time for me!
Most riders are right-hand shy. This is because vision is usually more limited for right hand turns, and because the right hand is used to control the throttle. Chopping the throttle is a bad idea in almost any situation, but especially during a lean. Chopping upsets the suspension, which could cause your rubber to lose grip on pavement = ouch!
As always, I recommend reading Total Control by Lee Parks. Awesome book, and has tons of drills to improve your riding skills.
And VooDoo, I don't think practice is boring! Any time spent in the saddle is fun time for me!
Jules
#24
05-23-2008 | 08:10 PM
Banned
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
RE: riding questions
Well I've had a chance to get some riding on film, the only problem is Google maps isn't being friendly with larger images of the steets... Until I solve that problem I thought I would show a little bit how I've practiced slow speeds a lot and still do when I get bored. Dunno why I first started riding in tight circles but I quickly realized I didn't like to go right.
So then I figured I might as wellgo toa parking lot until I get over the fear of dropping the bike to the right. A little trial and error and Irealized I could do better if I rode the rear brake, lol. At first I thought I was a cheater but then after some reading, talking with some bike copsand some YouTube searches I realized that's how they are able to do that amazing stuff at super slow speeds.
So anyway, here is the video - take what you will from it, don't laugh at my hick accent (that's aimed towards you NE'ers
), hopefully it will help a few of ya learn to control your bike more and become more confident in your ability to do so in emergency situations...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijl5z...p;feature=user
When I can find a good, large-size Google map of some corners I'll get some video of me taking them and reference the image while doing so, I'm thinking that would probably help the most.
(I got footage of me hitting a gravel patch yesterday on a corner - spooked me! I might upload it later if anyone wants to see it, lol).
So then I figured I might as wellgo toa parking lot until I get over the fear of dropping the bike to the right. A little trial and error and Irealized I could do better if I rode the rear brake, lol. At first I thought I was a cheater but then after some reading, talking with some bike copsand some YouTube searches I realized that's how they are able to do that amazing stuff at super slow speeds.
So anyway, here is the video - take what you will from it, don't laugh at my hick accent (that's aimed towards you NE'ers
), hopefully it will help a few of ya learn to control your bike more and become more confident in your ability to do so in emergency situations... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijl5z...p;feature=user
When I can find a good, large-size Google map of some corners I'll get some video of me taking them and reference the image while doing so, I'm thinking that would probably help the most.
(I got footage of me hitting a gravel patch yesterday on a corner - spooked me! I might upload it later if anyone wants to see it, lol).
#25
05-23-2008 | 11:16 PM
Banned
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
RE: riding questions
Okay so I got another one up.
This one is a video of a decreasing radius corner and how I approach them. When I come to any blind corner, I treat it as if it's a decreasing radius because I feel if gives me more options considering my posititioning of the bike in the driving lane.
This may very well be all elementary stuff, so some of you who may not have quesitons or whatever, please... be gentle, the idea is to help some people.
Okay so when I come to a blind corner, I set the bike in the inside half of the line (next to the centerline), and use engine braking upon entry unless I'm hauling *** but that's for another thread- anyway, as I make my entrance my head is looking through the turn and simultaneously I begin to dip the bike in that direction (intentional "target fixation" if you will). Now the only real "tough" part is deciding... When to dip the bike? When to make the turn?
Well that's what I wanted Google maps for but I'll see if I can explain it - think of it this way;
You're taking the apex of the corner and essentially, movingit (in a decreasing radius). For if you began to turn in following the centerline you'd find yourself having to make an accute angle turn at-speed... doesn't sound like fun (or even very possible for that matter). So what you're going to do is move the apex to a point sooner by simply treating it as the apex.
I don't know if I'm making much sense, I've never really talked at length about it but I'm always thinking about it, lol. Most people become bored of talking about **** like this but I look at it this way - if it can be my fault that I wreck I should also be responsible for avoiding **** too (which I seem to do too much of - already have like 4 near-misses on tape since 3 days ago) and the best defense is a good offense (yeah I changed it to suit me).
Anyway, the video you'll see me at one point (11-12 seconds) "cut into" the turn. That's what I mean by movingthe apex. As the street lays the actual apex is later in the turn than I took it. At that point I come back to the throttle (sometimes you won't come off the throttle, just depends) as this is happening my looking ahead continues and now I'm looking well out of the turn and like magic the bike will fluidly match your "instructions."
I read somewhere once that people ask about turning and, when do you turn? When is a turn over? The best response I've heard is that a corner begins when you back off the throttle and finishes when you no are longer concerned with it.
Seems like the toughest part is when to dip the bike or when to begin the turn. If you're looking ahead as habit (always always always looking ahead, scanning, etc.) you will naturally find your own line because looking ahead is sort of like taking away all the unnecessary road space therefore limiting the amount of space you need to succesfullyoperate your motorcycle therefore lessening your chances of a small hazard becoming a huge obstacle.
Haha, I'm rambling bad...
This one is a video of a decreasing radius corner and how I approach them. When I come to any blind corner, I treat it as if it's a decreasing radius because I feel if gives me more options considering my posititioning of the bike in the driving lane.
This may very well be all elementary stuff, so some of you who may not have quesitons or whatever, please... be gentle
, the idea is to help some people.Okay so when I come to a blind corner, I set the bike in the inside half of the line (next to the centerline), and use engine braking upon entry unless I'm hauling *** but that's for another thread- anyway, as I make my entrance my head is looking through the turn and simultaneously I begin to dip the bike in that direction (intentional "target fixation" if you will). Now the only real "tough" part is deciding... When to dip the bike? When to make the turn?
Well that's what I wanted Google maps for but I'll see if I can explain it - think of it this way;
You're taking the apex of the corner and essentially, movingit (in a decreasing radius). For if you began to turn in following the centerline you'd find yourself having to make an accute angle turn at-speed... doesn't sound like fun (or even very possible for that matter). So what you're going to do is move the apex to a point sooner by simply treating it as the apex.
I don't know if I'm making much sense, I've never really talked at length about it but I'm always thinking about it, lol. Most people become bored of talking about **** like this but I look at it this way - if it can be my fault that I wreck I should also be responsible for avoiding **** too (which I seem to do too much of - already have like 4 near-misses on tape since 3 days ago) and the best defense is a good offense (yeah I changed it to suit me).
Anyway, the video you'll see me at one point (11-12 seconds) "cut into" the turn. That's what I mean by movingthe apex. As the street lays the actual apex is later in the turn than I took it. At that point I come back to the throttle (sometimes you won't come off the throttle, just depends) as this is happening my looking ahead continues and now I'm looking well out of the turn and like magic the bike will fluidly match your "instructions."
I read somewhere once that people ask about turning and, when do you turn? When is a turn over? The best response I've heard is that a corner begins when you back off the throttle and finishes when you no are longer concerned with it.
Seems like the toughest part is when to dip the bike or when to begin the turn. If you're looking ahead as habit (always always always looking ahead, scanning, etc.) you will naturally find your own line because looking ahead is sort of like taking away all the unnecessary road space therefore limiting the amount of space you need to succesfullyoperate your motorcycle therefore lessening your chances of a small hazard becoming a huge obstacle.
Haha, I'm rambling bad...
#26
05-24-2008 | 12:28 AM
Friend and Hero ...
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,596
Likes: 0
From: Worldwide not a joke
RE: riding questions
I will say kid is giving some sound solid advice here I would like to stress. Not to ride beyond your comfort zone, do not give in to peer pressure by more experienced riders to push yourself beyond your limitations and for god sakes do not become point focused in a corner. You should however gradually push yourself to improve your skills, pick up a few track days. If they're available in your area. Also I would suggest picking up a couple of books, one of the best I personally feel is Sport Riding Techniques by Nick Ienatsch and don't worry about the chicken strip thing you have to become very comfortable with the bike and be truly listening and feeling how its handling and know where its limits and your are at this will come with time and experience. Just enjoy yourself practice as much as possible in a safe area
Just every once in awhile a little too far over
#27
05-24-2008 | 02:14 AM
Jan 2009 ROTM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,493
Likes: 0
RE: riding questions
Some absolutly great advice up there. Kid real nice work bud. +1 to Hardcorp also. As HC also stated dont ever get into the chicken strip thing, its absolutely 100% pointless and an idiotic debate. Just to prove my point here are mine
Heres what the ability to ride the edge of my tires got me.
Do like you said, go and practice, learn, and most important, have fun. When do start getting good though, dont ever get over confident. There is no place for that riding these machines, you MUST always respect them, they will toss you the moment you dont.
Heres what the ability to ride the edge of my tires got me.
Do like you said, go and practice, learn, and most important, have fun. When do start getting good though, dont ever get over confident. There is no place for that riding these machines, you MUST always respect them, they will toss you the moment you dont.
#28
05-24-2008 | 03:41 AM
Banned
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,113
Likes: 0
From: Seattle WA
RE: riding questions
ORIGINAL: KidCr3nshaw
Okay so I got another one up.
This one is a video of a decreasing radius corner and how I approach them. When I come to any blind corner, I treat it as if it's a decreasing radius because I feel if gives me more options considering my posititioning of the bike in the driving lane.
This may very well be all elementary stuff, so some of you who may not have quesitons or whatever, please... be gentle, the idea is to help some people.
Okay so when I come to a blind corner, I set the bike in the inside half of the line (next to the centerline), and use engine braking upon entry unless I'm hauling *** but that's for another thread- anyway, as I make my entrance my head is looking through the turn and simultaneously I begin to dip the bike in that direction (intentional "target fixation" if you will). Now the only real "tough" part is deciding... When to dip the bike? When to make the turn?
Well that's what I wanted Google maps for but I'll see if I can explain it - think of it this way;
You're taking the apex of the corner and essentially, movingit (in a decreasing radius). For if you began to turn in following the centerline you'd find yourself having to make an accute angle turn at-speed... doesn't sound like fun (or even very possible for that matter). So what you're going to do is move the apex to a point sooner by simply treating it as the apex.
I don't know if I'm making much sense, I've never really talked at length about it but I'm always thinking about it, lol. Most people become bored of talking about **** like this but I look at it this way - if it can be my fault that I wreck I should also be responsible for avoiding **** too (which I seem to do too much of - already have like 4 near-misses on tape since 3 days ago) and the best defense is a good offense (yeah I changed it to suit me).
Anyway, the video you'll see me at one point (11-12 seconds) "cut into" the turn. That's what I mean by movingthe apex. As the street lays the actual apex is later in the turn than I took it. At that point I come back to the throttle (sometimes you won't come off the throttle, just depends) as this is happening my looking ahead continues and now I'm looking well out of the turn and like magic the bike will fluidly match your "instructions."
I read somewhere once that people ask about turning and, when do you turn? When is a turn over? The best response I've heard is that a corner begins when you back off the throttle and finishes when you no are longer concerned with it.
Seems like the toughest part is when to dip the bike or when to begin the turn. If you're looking ahead as habit (always always always looking ahead, scanning, etc.) you will naturally find your own line because looking ahead is sort of like taking away all the unnecessary road space therefore limiting the amount of space you need to succesfullyoperate your motorcycle therefore lessening your chances of a small hazard becoming a huge obstacle.
Haha, I'm rambling bad...
Okay so I got another one up.
This one is a video of a decreasing radius corner and how I approach them. When I come to any blind corner, I treat it as if it's a decreasing radius because I feel if gives me more options considering my posititioning of the bike in the driving lane.
This may very well be all elementary stuff, so some of you who may not have quesitons or whatever, please... be gentle
, the idea is to help some people.Okay so when I come to a blind corner, I set the bike in the inside half of the line (next to the centerline), and use engine braking upon entry unless I'm hauling *** but that's for another thread- anyway, as I make my entrance my head is looking through the turn and simultaneously I begin to dip the bike in that direction (intentional "target fixation" if you will). Now the only real "tough" part is deciding... When to dip the bike? When to make the turn?
Well that's what I wanted Google maps for but I'll see if I can explain it - think of it this way;
You're taking the apex of the corner and essentially, movingit (in a decreasing radius). For if you began to turn in following the centerline you'd find yourself having to make an accute angle turn at-speed... doesn't sound like fun (or even very possible for that matter). So what you're going to do is move the apex to a point sooner by simply treating it as the apex.
I don't know if I'm making much sense, I've never really talked at length about it but I'm always thinking about it, lol. Most people become bored of talking about **** like this but I look at it this way - if it can be my fault that I wreck I should also be responsible for avoiding **** too (which I seem to do too much of - already have like 4 near-misses on tape since 3 days ago) and the best defense is a good offense (yeah I changed it to suit me).
Anyway, the video you'll see me at one point (11-12 seconds) "cut into" the turn. That's what I mean by movingthe apex. As the street lays the actual apex is later in the turn than I took it. At that point I come back to the throttle (sometimes you won't come off the throttle, just depends) as this is happening my looking ahead continues and now I'm looking well out of the turn and like magic the bike will fluidly match your "instructions."
I read somewhere once that people ask about turning and, when do you turn? When is a turn over? The best response I've heard is that a corner begins when you back off the throttle and finishes when you no are longer concerned with it.
Seems like the toughest part is when to dip the bike or when to begin the turn. If you're looking ahead as habit (always always always looking ahead, scanning, etc.) you will naturally find your own line because looking ahead is sort of like taking away all the unnecessary road space therefore limiting the amount of space you need to succesfullyoperate your motorcycle therefore lessening your chances of a small hazard becoming a huge obstacle.
Haha, I'm rambling bad...
Good stuff kid.
Where is the vid of you and the gravel?
#30
05-24-2008 | 11:22 AM
Banned
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
RE: riding questions
Looks like I accidentally deleted one of the videos, I'll describe it but here is the gravel patch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yrUe4cr5DU(<-- nothing special just a close call and me meeting the fog line)
Notice when I approach the turn it's the same as in the other corndering video. I approach from the outside of the corner and move the apex by cutting into the corner sooner than the actual apex - if I had not made it a habit to turn this way I would have almost certainly ridden off the road and into the ditch as when I saw the gravel, I was in a lean. Also, notice how I don't chop the throttle or touch brakes (can't see the brakes but listen to the throttle), I simply stop accelerating as the gravel comes into my view. Might have seen it even sooner but that road is the crap (if you couldn't tell).
So anyway, what I'm wanting to convey is that by using the entire roadway that is available to you, you can lessen the chance you'll find yourself in a situation without an out. Sometimes I think people misunderstand what it is to, "have an out." It's not always going to be when there are cars around you sometimes you'll be all by your lonesome. But if you can develop good riding habits by being a VERY defensive rider (always thinking that some schmuck has got your name on his bumper), you can generally remain quite collected and do what needs done.
The second video was of me coming pretty hot into an esses section. Doing about 45 and I downshift into first to begin my next curve and... WHOOPS! BAM - I'm in neutral. I'll write a bit about that later as I gotta help my bro-in law remodel their bathroom!
Hopefully someone can take something good from this. I do enjoy riding around with my camera (
) getting some footage but I also keep thinking in the back of my mind that any one of you guys could find yourself (myself included) in a sticky spot, but the more you thinkabout what your bike does, what are your natural actions, etc. the better your chances of riding away (with a still clean bike) from a potentially ****ty situation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yrUe4cr5DU(<-- nothing special just a close call and me meeting the fog line)
Notice when I approach the turn it's the same as in the other corndering video. I approach from the outside of the corner and move the apex by cutting into the corner sooner than the actual apex - if I had not made it a habit to turn this way I would have almost certainly ridden off the road and into the ditch as when I saw the gravel, I was in a lean. Also, notice how I don't chop the throttle or touch brakes (can't see the brakes but listen to the throttle), I simply stop accelerating as the gravel comes into my view. Might have seen it even sooner but that road is the crap (if you couldn't tell).
So anyway, what I'm wanting to convey is that by using the entire roadway that is available to you, you can lessen the chance you'll find yourself in a situation without an out. Sometimes I think people misunderstand what it is to, "have an out." It's not always going to be when there are cars around you sometimes you'll be all by your lonesome. But if you can develop good riding habits by being a VERY defensive rider (always thinking that some schmuck has got your name on his bumper), you can generally remain quite collected and do what needs done.
The second video was of me coming pretty hot into an esses section. Doing about 45 and I downshift into first to begin my next curve and... WHOOPS! BAM - I'm in neutral. I'll write a bit about that later as I gotta help my bro-in law remodel their bathroom!
Hopefully someone can take something good from this. I do enjoy riding around with my camera (
) getting some footage but I also keep thinking in the back of my mind that any one of you guys could find yourself (myself included) in a sticky spot, but the more you thinkabout what your bike does, what are your natural actions, etc. the better your chances of riding away (with a still clean bike) from a potentially ****ty situation.