First things first. I know this is an incredibly hot topic. If you're annoyed just say that, or try to say nothing at all.

I don't really have a single position on it.

I'd like to avoid personal experience stories as they tend to lead to the hottest flame wars and really don't add to the situation in terms of what gun legislation/law really mean.

Each state in the United States has their own gun policy - correct? How does that generally work? How many people carry weapons frequently? Is (non-firearm) road a significant problem? Are firearms frequently involved in road rage incidents?

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First. The gun situation in Canada and the States is probably (as far as I can tell) divided more accurately between urban and rural. I've had a very rural utilitiarian firearm up bringing. I've used them for years as a tool, and for almost as many years as part of my occupation and my one time sport (biathalon and target shooting). I'm not a ban firearms person, however, I do like to know that the people that own them do know what they're doing and how to properly store them.

With the exception of some of our major cities, Canada is really pretty rural... which probably has as much to do with our current situation than anything.

In Canada concealed carry is pretty much exclusively law enforcement. Firearm possession is relatively easy for long guns (rifles/shotguns) and progressively harder for semi-automatics (with more than x shot magazines) and for restricted weapons (short barrel shotguns/handguns) it's really difficult to obtain. I couldn't get a handgun without going through some serious hoops, and I could only transport it from my home to an approved range (locked and away from driver).

Part of the legislation I think makes sense in that - it would be very unlikely to be put in situation where 'in the heat of the moment' one were to use the firearm in a brass and uncalculated move. For instance, my firearms are properly stored in seperate parts - firing pins removed from bolts, bodies trigger locked in a cabinet, and ammunition stored in a seperate locked container. Essentially unavailable. As where I live I don't consider them home protection (rightly or wrongly that doesn't bother me).

In Canada I'm not 100% happy with the gun registry. As a law abiding citizen I've registered my firearms. IF the legislation changes they could come and take my firearms. Every 5 years I have to pay a fee for owning my firearms and provide a new picture. I also have to notify them when ever I move. If I hadn't of been a law abiding citizen I would have taken equally good care to store my firearms in an appropriate way... On the other hand, it does provide a paper trail that could be used to exhonerate a firearm owner who transfers their firearm to another owner. Essentially - you'd be an idiot to use a registered firearm in an inappropriate way. The somewhat interesting thing, it isn't conversely true that only criminals would own unregistered firearms... so our system works on some levels, but fails on others.

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I think there are situations where people get PO'ed and respond inappropriately. I know that I have referred to other drivers in negative ways when they make poor decisions. I also know that the road is filled with many people who are a lot less stable than I am. In Canada, or at least where I live (Urban/Sub-Urban eastern Canada) I am 99.9% confident that other drivers do not have firearms. I take some (not that much) solice in that...

I can understand the right to bear arms... what I guess I'm concerned about (unjustly?) that if I were living some place where many people had firearms, that in a poor thought out moment they'd decide to use it in an inappropriate way.

I can understand the pandora's box arguement; where since the cat is out of the bag it is impossible to bag it up again... and so I don't see that as a feasible solution. Nor, do I see it as reasonabl

 

This issue can be a volitile topic -- let's keep it civil. Feel free to state your opinion but I will not let this turn into a political-type thread. Seems the forum has done very well since those divisive threads have gone bye-bye.

thanks for your support

 

Ok, I would like to address the the issue of justifying carrying a concealed weapon to de-escelate a situation by just "Whipping it out"....
I for one to not subscribe to this theory (for the most part). I think too many people think that brandishing a firearm is a good way to end disputes/arguements etc. People who too readily brandish thier weapons for inappropriate reasons are more likely to get themselves into trouble eventually. It is illegal to brandish a firearm where I live. Besides being illegal, I was trained not to pull out my weapon unless I truly had the intent/willingness to use it. By that I mean the weapon is not a means to settle verbal arguements, heated debates, ward off harmless but obnoxious drunks in the parking lot etc. The brandishing of a weapon must be thought of as a serious choice, with the very real possibility to escelate things to another level, it could de-escelate situations as well but the point I am trying to make is, a responsible concealed weapons carrier will assess the situation for imminent life threatening danger and weigh the possible outcomes before making thier decision.
As for how does it make one feel safer....
Well I guess the best way I could explain it in a sort of universal way is this,
Imagine if you can that you are an average individual of less than average stature,
now imagine you and someone you love are walking down the street when you are confronted by two or more very large individuals.
If they have weapons, even if its something very basic like a stick, chain, knife etc. you are helpless.
They could threaten your life and your loved ones in an attempt to mug you of your belonging, and upon giving up those items and obliging the hoodlums, you and your loved one would still be at thier mercy. Who is to say they wouldn't decide to rape your lady friend, or beat you both for fun, etc.
Yes you could state it's the police's job to take care of that sort of thing but honestly, how often do you really think Police are going to be able to swoop in right as the crime is being commited? It's usually more like "We will take your report and investigate this" if you are lucky enough to be around to file a report.
I don't view my weapon as the "go to" solution for disputes etc. I view my weapon as a tool that provides me with more options in dire situations. Which to me, makes me feel a little more secure.
As for how I carry my gun while riding:
Usually I carry mine in my usuall waistband holster which can be a bit tricky. It is secure thier but can be a little uncomfortable if you don't get your "junk" situated just right. I also ride with a backpack almost always, and I have a compartment on my back pack I can readily unzip and reach if needed.
As for lefties having an advantage, I have trained to be ambidexterous, so left, right, whatever doesn't matter.

 

I just wish they would pass a law already that would make murder illegal. Everyone knows that it is the Law/statute that prevents crime. I mean we have speed limit/traffic laws to keep people from driving reckless. We've all seen how speed limits/traffic laws have kept everyone from speeding, unsafe lane changes, and the like.

Seriously. We have had the problem of murder, hate, violence and agression long before the invention of firearms. Why blame an inamiate object for the failings of human beings.

 

I think the difference between a firearm and a stick is that of range and immediacy...

that being said - I tend to agree with you in so far as - it's not the law abiding citizens we really have to worry about. Then again, even your average law abiding citizen can make silly decisions and personally I'd rather they not make those decisions with any weapon.

I guess on your comment "I just wish they would pass a law already that would make murder illegal. " you strike upon a truth - that it's only criminals that go out with the intent on breaking the law... and no I'm not talking about relatively harmless things like speeding, and more about the mugging scenario that was previously mentioned. It's true, and I agree with you, the law doesn't change the fact that you were harmed. On the otherhand, the intent of the justice system is supposed to be a deterent as much as a punishment. If there was no fear of punishment I'm sure we'd see a huge upswing in crime. For that reason one could argue that laws with regards to improper usage of firearms might deter their use in crime?

I understand the previous mugging scenario. Certianly in that situation it makes sense to use any means necessary. Does that mean I'm foolish for not carrying a gun at all times? I don't know. I'm likely naive when I beleive that 'it couldn't happen' here - but mathmatically ( small solstice I suppose after the fact) I don't beleive it likely that I would be in a situation where I currently live. That's a geographical and a personal decision wrapped into one. Given my situation, I've decided not to (even if I could legally), but given a different situation I could see how one might change their position on the matter.

All posters have expressed their thought out and careful approach to ownership. I'm certain that the majority of people view it in a simular way... my concern would be that there might be some that don't view it in the same way? I guess, if so then all the more reason to carry one oneself?

 

^^^^hey i thought murder was illegal....lol

 

WOOT.

You strike me as a smart guy. Your previous post indicate that you are a logical, rational, and educated person.

The problem with the gun debate is that it tends to be driven by feelings and emotion, rather than rational logical thought. I can tell you from first hand experience that the possession of a firearm in no way is indicative of a person with a violent, unbalanced, and threatening mentality. The posession of an object alone does not alter your personality.

Believe it or not, by owing a gun you actually posessing, or carrying it at times. I'd assume that you have taken your firearm to the range, or hunting, or used it for some other lawful purpose. At the time, did you feel some, or ANY, desire to use that firearm in a unlawful manner? I'd wager you didn't. You know how you feel about the responsible ownership of weapons. The flaw in your logic is that your are applying your FEELINGS about what your think other people, whom you don't know, might do when they own a weapon. Practially all of them are just like you, honest, responsible, and balnaced. Fear is a powerful motivator. If you remove logic and reason from it all together you end up making assumptions and seeing the boogey-man around every corner.

The most likely individuals to use a weapon unlawfully are criminals. Even they do not fall under the presumption that they always resort to a gun to settle a dispute or such. The statistics do not bear that out.

Falling under the pretense on restricting an object to controll a problem, that is based within human nature and is predominately a result of societal ills, is a non-starter. Washington DC has a complete ban on handguns. For the last several years it has had the highest handgun murder rate, even while the ban has been in affect.

 

reneg comment

 

I'll pich in on this one......I am an avid sportsman and competitive shooter, IDPA, Fun Steel, NRA High-Power, clays, you name it. I have had My CCW for some time and truly believe that 99.9999999 of legal concealed carry folks are rational responsible individuals. Any verbal confrontation I've ever dealt with, I simply thought of safety first, was the mature one about it, and simply walked away and avoided a potentially dangerous situation. I carry because there is no shortage of weirdos and violent folks with little or no regard to others safety, well-being or life, and I refuse to be a victim of these individuals. I pray and hope I never have to clear leather with my weapon cuase that means some **** hit the fan and I am having to save my, or a loved ones life by eliminating a seriously life threatening issue. I don't agree with some of the veiws on here and some might not agree with mine, but thats what makes us all different and I welcome that diversity. I think that allot of people think of us who carry concealed legally as some gun loving maniac that is waiting to just blow someone away, when that simply isn't the case for 99.9% of us. I am responsible for my own health and well-being. I am responsible for the safety and livelyhood of my family, I am their protector, and I refuse to be a number due to someones else's poor judgement or lack of concern for others. The gun debate could go on for ions. Theres the sayings....Blaming guns for crime is like blaming matches for arson, pencils don't cause misspelled words ect.....a gun is peice of wood and metal, no better or worse that the man or woman behind it. Ask England and Australia how banning guns reduced their crime rate........
For the sake of this forum, I'm a lefty, and carry a 1911 in a milt sparks VM2 IWB, nice and tight, well concealed and comfy, fits under all my gear or even a t-shirt with ease and is readily available.

 

Gun control is an important issue but like everything else education is of critical importance to avoid accidents. Intentional shootings are a threat but small in most cases. The Highest cause of death for people in my age category is motor vehicle accidents, you dont see anyone complaining to ban teenage drivers....