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No start..fuel pump??

  #1  
Old 07-23-2011, 11:59 AM
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Default No start..fuel pump??

Hi there,
Great forum you guys have here and I'm hpoing someone out there can help.

2001 F4I had low sided. Fairings and gear shifter were damaged. Rode the bike home after a few pieces of wire and tape...no issues.

Replaced the fairings and shifter and now it wont start.
The bike cranks over really well but no start.
All fuses checked OK ,all plugs connected.
No fuel pump noise prior to cranking with the key in the "ON" position.( Noramlly it can be heard).

This is what I know:...gear in neutral, Engine stop ON, Key to ON....1Red Lite & Neutral lite on dash (assuming red is always there before a start), Oil icon is flashing........
->Starter relay has power to one side(thick wires) and the plug into the starter relay has power to the larger Red wire of the three.(Key on)
->Two relays under rear seat: 1 relay has power to the Red wire and so does a Black wire on the same relay ( key on).
other relay under rear seat has no power at all ( 2 Brown and 2 Black wires)..(with Key ON).
NO Fuel Pump noise with Key ON...check power to plug at pump and find No power. If external power is supplied to pump it works fine.

When the starter button is pushed....it cranks over great.
-> Starter relay has power to the other large wire ( to the starter motor), and at the plug...the yellow wire gets power...this is with the starter button pushed.
-> with starter button pushed...the back two relays have no changes to them.

Thats what I know...what i dont know is what are the two relays under the back seat and why does the one with the Brown wires have no power at all during the start sequence. Also i dont know what the two relays are in the front fairing mounted in the center as well as the "black box" above them...could they be headlite relay(s) and a Tilt sensor...could they have any impact on this no start issue. Tilt sensor fell off during spill but remians in the sameish position.
Sorry for being long winded but i dont want to miss any details as I'm sure this will help someone understand clearly the issue.
Pls and Thnx !
 
  #2  
Old 07-23-2011, 12:52 PM
Honda125 358's Avatar
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I'm fighting with the same thing. I'm pretty sure my issue is in the relay area. I can get the pump to prime when I jump two of the wires going into the relay.

Your two relays are the fuel stop relay and engine cut relay. The fuel stop relay in the rearmost relay. Engine cut is 1" closer to the front. Both on the side of the subframe (just to make sure we are on the same page).

Could you do me an infinitely huge favor and take a picture of your fuel stop relay (the one with two black/white wires, one brown and one brown/white)? That would be AWESOME! If not its okay too. I had to take my harness (the white plastic thing the relay plugs into) off because my connectors were loose. Now I realize the picture I took before I started was insufficient

I do have some more info I've gathered while fighting with this non priming issue. I also have an 01 f4i.
 
  #3  
Old 07-23-2011, 03:50 PM
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hey Honda 125 358,
thanks for your response and help!

you have describe the rear two relays exactly..we r on the same page!
Yes i will take pics for you but it will take a day or so for me to upload.
This bike im workin on is not mine or at my place so ..i will take pics today and upload when i return to my place.

so now i know what those two rear relays are ...should the rearmost one( fuel stop relay) , with the brown wires , have any power?...cuz it doesn't.With the key on i probe the back of the relay , where the wires go in, without disconnecting, and find no power on any wires.
 
  #4  
Old 07-23-2011, 05:59 PM
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ok so....i've since noticed that the tilt sensor was incorrectly positioned.
I did not realize what it was but after talking to a bike mechanic he was saying that the engine stop relay , most rearward with brown wires, might be not receiving power dur to the tilt , kickstand, or clutch sensors.

I have correctly mounted the tilt sensor and ...voila!! problem solved !
Bike starts normally now !
 
  #5  
Old 07-23-2011, 10:45 PM
Honda125 358's Avatar
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Ahhh you're so lucky to have a functioning bike
 
  #6  
Old 07-24-2011, 11:16 AM
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Honda 125 ___,

I have sent you a Private message with the pics you wanted...hope they help you.

What i learned was that three things , at least , feed into the engine stop relay( rearmost relay)...clutch , kickstand , and tilt switches. My issue was an incoerrectly secured tilt sensor

My issue was easy once understood....thanks to the input from you and others.
Thanks again.
 
  #7  
Old 07-24-2011, 04:21 PM
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OK so i had the ride working but I have now just learned this ride I;m working on is no longer starting...again. Similar issue that being no power to the engine stop realy. Again when i bring the power to the relay all works. One other thing now is the headlite does not come on and the blue headlite indicator on the dash is on...?

when a ground is supplied to either headlite , at the plug, the pump comes on and the headlite lites up and the blue indicator on the dash disappears and engine starts.

What / why is the headlite not working??...is it something to do with the headlite relay and is that one of them mounted up front? Can i swap relays up front to assist with this troubleshooting?
 
  #8  
Old 07-25-2011, 06:29 PM
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: CA
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i would bypass the TILT sensor, it causes alot of Problems, cut all three wires and join tho outside ones together, leave the middle one alone, the TILT sensor gives so many people here problems its not even funny, and when i had trouble with mine the tilt sensor does have something to do with the headlight, mine did the same thing. GET RID OF THE PIECE OF ****T SENSOR and see if that helps.
GOOD LUCK
JDIZZEL
 
  #9  
Old 07-26-2011, 11:41 AM
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sounds like the ground from the BAS in the main harness isn't making a solid connection. the main harness is the big gray block by the left air intake tube...you are looking for the green wire in one of the corners. if it isn't making a solid connection, the fuel pump won't prime & therefore, the bike won't start. you can correct this issue by putting a very slight twist in the pin...just be careful not to twist it too much as then you won't be able to plug the harness back together. that particular wire seems to cause a lot of issues.
 
  #10  
Old 07-30-2011, 08:53 AM
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Xander and guys,...
That was exactly what this ride needed !!
A ground to the BAS ( tilt sensor)....i just brought a good grnd to the green wire in the harness at the front by the left headlite and ....vroom!!

Now install fairings and watch it go.

THANKS sooo much to all that have helpped out with this ride.
I came to thid forum for help from experts and got exactly that !
 

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