First Post! Bought a bike that needs help.
 

Hey guys!

As the title states, this is my first post, and I'm needing some help with the bike I just picked up. For reference, it's an '87 1000f.

I have utilized the Search feature of the forum already, using 'Starter' as a keyword. I came across threads illustrating the failure to start the engine due to an alternator damper, a reduction gear and also a broken starter chain. I'm not sure which one of these might be the problem I'm experiencing, so I will go forth in explaining what I have personally experienced so far:

Again, I bought the bike with known starting problems. The previous owner states that, from his own research, he found out that a "plastic gear needed to be replaced, and the bike will only start with a bump-start. Makes a grinding noise when using the electric start."

From here I decided that I would start the repair process with a known-good starter motor. I bought one in good working order and installed it.

We encountered the grinding, or rattling sound when we tried to start the bike last night; The motor does turn freely and almost fired a few times, and I'm sure it would have if we could get a few more rotations out of it. However, whatever is causing the motor to not be able to turn over constantly, and only occasionally as the starter motor is activated is the problem. Here's how we pursued the diagnosis:

> We then uninstalled the starter and tested it outside of the motor. Perfect working order. Spins quickly and quietly (no abnormal noises).

> We reinstalled and encountered the same problem again.

> We then noticed that the noise we were hearing was coming from an area we thought to be behind the alternator. We unbolted the 3 bolts of the alternator and were able to slide the unit out of the engine case by an inch and a half or so (we weren't able to get it out completely. From what I understand, the retaining mechanism for this is under the cover directly below the starter motor, however correct me if I'm wrong.) We hit the starter button and heard the sound of a healthy starter, with no grinding.

> Reinstalled the alternator with the same symptoms as before.

So, what I can conclude is that the problem lies with a component of the alternator assembly, or a component directly associated with it's functionality. Can you guys help me determine what it is and how to repair this?

Much thanks in advance! :icon_wink:

And if you're wondering...she's going to be a custom streetfighter when completed! (Purists: don't be too angry...she was beyond repair as far as the original plastics and fairings. Too far gone cosmetically for a restoration)

Could it be the bearings on the stator. There is a section where you can download the manuals. LINK Also could you post a Vid so we could hear it.

Thanks for the quick reply Indiana!

I've downloaded what seems to be the Honda factory pdf manual from that link already, and it doesn't seem too helpful as to diagnosis and repair procedures. Is there a better manual out there (i.e. Haynes or Bentley)?

I will try to capture a video of the sound within the next few days (facepalm! should have done that last night while I was at the shop) and try to help you guys out in diagnosis.

Any further help appreciated!

Haynes is here- http://cid-f661f6844a8cd45e.skydrive...e.aspx/.Public

Nice! Haynes looks like it should be quite useful!

To be honest it sounds like the alternator damper is totally kaput to me or if previously repaired was not done right

Just a small update [no video as of yet to capture the sound for you guys. boo :( ] in the form of a question:

If I was to start having to search for replacement parts for this alternator, what are some good sources to use? Google-searching is only yielding a few results. Are these parts almost impossible to come by these days?

I have used BIKEBANDIT.

http://fiche.ronayers.com/Index.cfm/...Model/CBR1000F
Generally cheaper than list.

CheapCycleParts.com usually 15 ---> 20% cheaper

I second cheapcycleparts.com I've ordered everything through them.

awesome! I'll be sure to check them all out! Thanks for the help so far guys!

Hopefully I'll be able to get this video up soon. I know, from watching all the other videos posted here, that the sound my starting system is producing is much different...

Another Update!

Found a video clip that includes the same sounds (and presumably same issue) as my 100f is having (Note: this isn't my bike, or video):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-Nep...eature=related


Let me know what you guys think it might be!

imo ................still going with the damper as the culprit

As he said it began doing it when hot and progressively started the same even cold.

A progressively deteriorating ( deteriorated and done already in vid ) damper imo

UPDATE:

Decided to replace the alternator damper outside of the bike, so I dropped the engine and began working on it tonight.

We were able to pull the alternator apart to the point where there was nothing left to the assembly except for the rear aluminum cover closest to the engine, and the alternator shaft itself (illustrated here: http://www.cheapcycleparts.com/model...ssemblies/7887 as the part between #s 23 and 10).

We can't, for the life of us, put enough pressure on the 14mm wrench to get the nut off the end of the shaft (the nut underneath the access cover that sits under the starter motor) :icon_doh:

Is it counter-threaded or anything? any special hints I should know of to get that sucker off? Any hints would be awesome!

UPDATE:

Alternator off, new alternator damper installed, reinstalled the alternator assembly.

In looking at the old, suspect damper: not abnormal movement or play in any of the parts. No visual wear or damage.

From what my shop-mate explained to me; he feels that the movement of the damper is a lot tighter than before. He states that when you put a 14mm wrench on the alternator shaft nut (under the access port) and rotate counter-clockwise, the 'clicks' of the rotation of the shaft feel much tighter...but I'm really wondering as to if that's the result we were hoping for. Can't really tell for sure if the problem is solved until the engine is back in the bike.


Any thoughts or input?

It's not possible to put enough pressure on a damper by hand - I've tried. Replace with the new one and it should be fine.