I was just reading a car mag and a Michelin engineer who "tests driver behavior" was quoted as saying "Most people, when faced with cornering beyond 0.4 g or hitting a tree, choose the tree."

That got me thinking, as my son quoted his motorcycle instructor as telling him that if he thought he was going into a corner too fast, to just trust the bike, because it will turn a lot harder than he would be willing to.

I have actually experienced this a little, always inadvertently, and I try to keep it at a minium, as I have known a few guys who chose the tree and lost, with a couple paying the ultimate price.

So I start researching to find some skid pad numbers for bikes. Can't find any. I know a great car 27 years ago was .82 - .85 g. Now, a civic will probably do that. Over .9 is getting pretty routine for a decent car. I Really just wanted to be able to roughly compare bikes to cars, as I think I have a good feel for what cars will do based on their numbers. So I just wanted a sense of it. But I can't find dick.

Any thoughts?

 

I have no idea re: the G forces, but I will say this:

Rule 0: When you get to your turn-in point, turn. Period. Even if you find you're going way faster than you meant to be going, do it anyway. 90% of the time you'll make it and surprise yourself, and the other 10% you'll be a lot closer to the ground when you crash.

 

I reckon if a rider looses it in the corner it is 99.9% of the time because of rider error/lack of skill/experience , the bike can make it , it's the rider that causes the crash .

You see the 'stiff arm' riders every day , taking their weight on their arms and hence the bars , this precludes correct counter-steering 'cos your pushing against both bars . The inexperienced rider (me) gets into an emergency situation , tenses up his already stiff position on the bike causing him to run wide on the corner into on-coming traffic . BAM! head on , not good .

This has happened to me , but luckily I had an empty road to practice on , which is why I'm here to type this long boring reply

I try to remind myself to grip the tank with my knees , take the weight by tensing my stomach slightly and lean forward to bend my elbows . It totally transforms the way the bike behaves , the heavy lumbering beast becomes nimble and agile , changing direction with slight input to the bars add a bit of shoulder lean to the equation and suddenly you got Rossi type confidence in the corners and you realise the bike can lean a lot further than you ever felt comfortable with before . In a tight fast corner your head should be just about level with the inside mirror , you'll find to accomplish this your body position needs to be correct , with weight on the inside .

God don't I go on!!still that's 'old farts' for ya' tellin' everyone what to do

And sorry J to answer your question , no I don't have any figures , I'm not even sure they exist for bikes.

A final rant . With cars these figures only indicate the cornering limits , not the characteristics of the car when it reaches those limits i.e. how fast it 'lets go' in a corner . If it lets go too fast it can kill you , which was the old Porsche 911 problem

 

With ya on this one Hawk...........loosening up , gripping tank , shifting
weight and just generally finessing her with very subtle but forthright input
makes for riding the old girl like an angel and she becomes oh soo
responsive just like you said. You seldom end up in jam when you ride
confidently and fluidly like you describe.

My 2 cents

 

Excellent point. Really. No kidding. Hadn't thought about that last part.

 

Ok, I'll try it. And I presume the steering input you are talking about is countersteering, as you mentioned. I learned about countersteering long ago, but it never seems like I need to do it. That probably reflect the lame way I putter around, as compared to a serious, ***** out flier.

And it just dawned on me as I was riding around today (countersteering here and there even though it wasn't called for) that if you try to put a lateral G meter of some sort on a bike, you are going to need a gyro set up to keep it level. That may just be too darn much trouble.

Overall, my guess is that good bikes grip way better than good cars.

P.S. If you don't hear back from me, then you killed me.

 

No way will it kill you 'J'

If you don't know your counter-steering your doing it anyway , it's the only way to turn a bike above about 9-10 mph . You might find Juliets' little write-up interesting


And as for the grip bikes and cars get , I was always of the same opinion as you , but apparently if you pit a formula 1 car against a MotoGP bike the looser has two wheels . More wheels = more grip so can use more HP . Not as much fun though , I'll always be rootin' for the rider

 

I recommend a good book like Total Control by Lee Parks. I've been riding since 71 and I learned a bunch. Took the Total Control course and learned even more. If they teach the course nearby, I highly recommend it.

 

Exactly.


And what Hawk said about countersteering and bikes having less grip, he's right.

Slowpoke mentioned reading some books. That's a good idea.
Also, there are MSF (motorcycle safety foundation) courses you can take for cheap/free. They are a great resource.... and fun!

 

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