This is more of a rant than anything. So a lot of us local street bikers in huntington beach hang out on main street everyday around lunch time. One of our good friends rides a 2012 zx-14r. He's of good age and has well over 40 to 50 years riding experience. It seems almost everyday at least 5 or so people come up to him especially and talk about his bike.nothing wrong there. What's always kills me though is every once in a while every couple days or so, some folks will say they want to get this bikw. Non-riders, usually people that have ridden a dirtbike or two ikn their day, sometimes no riding experience at all. I'm guessing they hear the word ninja and their dick gets hard. I blow most off as just talking out of their *** because they have money, but there are a certain few that I believe WILL get the bike, and it scares the **** out of me. Maybe I'm too caring, but I have RARELY come cross anybody that bought a bike with more than 1000 cc's that did'ntgo down withenthe first few months and I absolutely hate hearing stories of people going down, because I can feel their pain. But with how caring I am, I have a very hard time feeling sorry for anybody buying that big of a bike and dropping it because they had no business being on that bike. Don't get me wrong, I support riding bikes like they should be ridden, but I have never even ridden a 600 to its limits on the most open canyon roads, nonetheless riding around town. I'm guessing these are the same people in their old *** ferrarris that think they can take me off the line when they pull up at a red light. Sorry, but a bike is NOT going to do all the work for you like a car.

I would love to hear your guys' opinion on this, weather you agree or not, I don't reccomend anything over a 600 as a first bike. Even a new 600 will get a new rider into a heap of trouble without the experience in tough road situations.

 

Yes, I feel your pain Red Baron.

Start small, learn to ride the smaller capacity bikes properly and then move up the ranks. You'll be a better rider for it because you will know all about keeping up cornering speeds to ride quickly. And if you do come off, you are less likely to kill yourself.

In Australia we have the 1%er wannabees that buy the big Harley, bling the living shi*t out of it, then stick it into a wall or under an on-coming car when the footboards bottom out on a corner. Yeah, yeah, I rode when I was young they'll tell you. A Peewee 50 or some such like. They become a danger to ALL road users, not just themselves.

My 2c.

Cheers, SB

 

I totally agree. I learned on a Ninja 250. I have an F4i and have ridden several other bikes larger and smaller. My best friend has a ZX10r and that thing is insane! 1/2 throttle off the line will stand it up and/or bring it over if you're not ready, I can only imagine a 14!!

I think some people see the word ninja and that's what they want, they don't even know the difference in sizes. But usually I tell them that over 600 is not the place to start- in a nice way of course. Gotta let them make their own choices though

 

id have to agree there. theres too many people out there that get large/fast bikes just as a status symbol.
and personally, i hate it when someone says a supersport 600 is a good bike to start on. i know if i had started on a 600 i probably would have killed myself. theres just too much power there for a beginner and they simply wont have the respect for it.
and really, starting out on a 600 would be like learning to drive in a supercar. its just gonna end badly.

 

i wasnt lookin for a street bike when i purchased my first 1. it was a 78 xs1100. it had pods and a jet kit. it was fast but i wasnt lookin for speed at the time. it was avail and i bought it. i rode dirt n licensed trail street bikes in the early days and was happy i knew how to balance in trail jumps etc, cause when the car in front of me had no brake lights and stopped suddenly, i swerved to miss his rear and ended up in a ditch with 550lbs of bike at my will. thats where my experience came in. i handled that bike into n out of that ditch without an accident. that was something ill always remember.
wanna be's are just that and usually end up goin down with the heavier bikes.

 

I'm gonna play Devil's Advocate here a min...

In the U.S. options for <600cc bikes were limited till last year really. Unfortunately we didn't get the cool 125s and 250s. The Ninja 250 was looking severely dated until recently as well. Which weren't readily available either due to demand. Look at the MSF BRC course. 250 cruisers, which are totally different animals to me. Me, living in the city my whole life, never had a dirt bike option (no dirt and barely any trees). So if you wanted to learn to ride, it was either a 600 or a cruiser. So it's not like new riders had much choice. That's changing now with more 250s and 500s being offered. But it will take time and a couple hellacious riders before they become popular choices.

Now for the D.A. part. Y'all know I have Yolie. She's one of the most technologically advanced bikes on the road. ABS and DTC assisting the rider so much that CSS (California Superbike School) uses them in their 2 day camps and saw a huge drop in class accidents. And now I'm impatiently waiting for my dealer to recieve my HP4. The HP4 comes with a piece of tech that will potentially change consumer motorcycles forever, semi-active dynamic suspension. All these rider aids making the bigger bikes more forgiving than before. And this year, Kawasaki adding traction control on the zx6r.

Basically, I think the game is changing. One of the most recognized track schools in the world putting track newbies onto one of the most powerful bikes in the world because it reduces accidents. Tech advances like DDC getting introduced, which will eventually spread to other bikes. Traction control starting to trickle down into the 600cc class. Would I recommend a s1k to someone who's never ridden before? Hell no.

But I can no longer say 600s can't be a starting point. If the zx6r had been released 1 year earlier, I'd prolly have that instead of Yolie.

 

i have to agree here to a point, yes bikes are becoming more advanced, and larger bikes are getting easier to ride and more forgiving.

but look at it this way, i think most of us could agree that the majority of sport bike riders that are starting out are in their late teens/early 20's. alot of people that age(including myself) are in college. now tell me how many college students are going to be able to afford a brand new bike? not many. most, like myself, end up going for older bikes that dont have all those technologies and arent as forgiving or as easy to ride.

now in ten or fifteen years when most of the second hand bikes have all those goodies, starting out on a supersport wouldnt be a bad idea.

But until then im still going to see it as a bad idea.

 

It's an issue that has to do with the current "You Tube Generation" as I like to call 'em. First, the videos that desensitize you to the actual speed of a sport bike. Of course you think you can do what that guy in the video is doing dumbass, you're sitting in front of a computer monitor and probably never even felt what top speed in your mom's minivan feels like. Then you've got the jack asses who comment on these videos (which I have to admit I read through with a almost a perverse enjoyment of the idiotic drama like some people eat up reality TV) saying stupid **** like "oh, it's only a 600" or "the Bugatti Veyron is still faster" or "Yeah, 600s are for wussies" or "What if Godzilla was on a Repsol and Casey Stoner was on a seven legged unicorn?" or whatever other idiotic thing they can come up with while their only submissions are of them playing CoD (usually poorly).

These people have no idea what the speed of a motorcycle is. Try to explain it... even to yourself in words. It's impossible. The number of times I've tried to explain the power of a liter bike and failed miserably to a guy just giving me a smirk as if to say, "Oh, that doesn't sound that fast, I can handle it".

Don't sweat it, dude. It's cool that you care about the well being of potential riders and I feel you on that. The more bikes we have on the road, the fewer cars and I love to see people really getting into the sport (yes, even if they are on Harleys). However, it's his/her money and plenty of drag racers out there are looking for dinged up ZX-14s they can buy on the cheap and build up from those who bought them and got scared away from motorcycles forever.

P.S. Depending on the dirt bike, some might be able to handle a ZX-14. (i.e. CR500)

P.P.S. If any of that came off as pissy, excuse me. it was a long weekend.

 

Had that much fun at the show Ray?

I do think advances in bikes (and the available safety gear) are muddling the water on the topic. If my best friend came up to me and said he was buying a s1k, I'd look at him like he lost his mind. I'd lay down the argumemts why he was about to waste $17k. And I'd try to push him towards a smaller bike.

But if I knew deep down he was serious, I know it would all be futile. So I'd be a good friend and responsible rider: do my best to make sure he survives. I'd take him to Revzilla (not actually necessary since he knows the owners). I'd offer to take the BRC with him again to show support. I'd go with him on rides, taking him to the corners and straights that I know would safely give him some real world experience.

You can't let it get to you. Ppl are going to believe what they want to believe until they get their perspective changed. Which we all know happens often since we've all seen 4+ year old bikes barely out of their breakin mileage up for sale. Yeah, they may act like d-bags straight from a failed casting attempt on the Jersey Shore Redux while they're safely standing 10' away from a bike.

Sitting astride one of these machines with the RPM ticking up to 9k, knowing the bike they talked chit about hasn't even begun to start to work and unable to see things as more than a blur... it's a different perspective.

Be the better man and try to prepare them for when that perspective comes. At least you can feel good about yourself.

Oh, actual living breathing squids don't count. Bout ready to smack one of them myself

 

Being an "Old school" biker myself, I see things perhaps a little differently.
The new mods to the 600's with traction control etc, and the ABS braking and slipper clutches on the bigger bikes make the bike easier to ride
BUT THEY DON'T MAKE YOU A BETTER RIDER
The bikes become more "forgiving" of mistakes which perhaps an older generation bike won't do, BUT if you can ride an older gen bike the newer ones will be easier.

Here's a "leap of faith" story.............I went from a 180cc Yamaha to a Katana 1000cc with a full Yoshi kit AND A TURBO. Believe me when I tell you that it was a learning experience OF NOTE
It didn't make me a better rider, it just scared the living bejeezus out of me because I couldn't handle the power, and I sold it before it killed me or I learned to handle it. Probably the best thing I could have done at the time.............

My suggestion for new riders would be to find an older generation bike, anything up to an old 750 would be fine to learn on and before 1990. The power back then was a lot less, the weight about the same, but no smart new gadgets. Yes, you won't look like "the new boy with the new toy" but when/if you drop it you won't feel as bad as dropping a newer bike and having to handle the costs involved.
My wife used to ride an old 350 Honda, and after a break of many years I found her an old CB750 Custom. She jumped straight on it and went. Still rides it to this day.
Would I put her on a newer 600 ?- NO WAY even with her experience level now.
Would I even let her near my 1000F ? - ditto, no way !
It's easier to ride a bike with bars which aren't tucked in like sports bike bars - newbies should start with something that will turn easily at slow speed and aren't too heavy.
What we want to do is help riders be the best they can be, and then move up to bikes which are faster, more powerful and more difficult to control.
Any keyboard commando who advocates jumping straight on even a moderately new 600 should get out there and do it before making fatuous remarks about "oh it's not that fast" - pffft but I suppose even muppets are allowed an opinion.

Sjona had it right IMO too
Raylee too !
My 2c worth.