Most of this has actually already been covered, but I started typing as soon as he posted this. But I'm suffering from that one handed handicap LOL
First of all most anyone who starts out on a 1000 is just asking for trouble. I don't care old one or a new one. I agree with you 100% Honda needs to bring the CBR 400 or some thing a little smaller into the US market. I sometimes wonder how salesmen can sleep at night knowing that they have just put some kid on about four times as much bike as they need but here is the really big problem. A lot of individuals approached buying a motorcycle in the same manner in which they would purchase a sportscars letting Pride and Male ego for the most part keeps them from starting out on something smaller that need for speed. That is
born and breed in us as Americans and those bragging rights will keep most guys from buying a small bike. Even if it was available in anything other than the ninja 250 I have 14 years riding experience on the street and about 6 yrs off road before that, but have spent probably five years of that either unable to ride or without a bike. So I will say I have ridden almost daily for nine years on a lot of different bikes on the street. Up until now, not a CBR have always loved Hondas had VFR and ST1100 in the past and had the use of about two Magna. Back to the subject at hand. My point here is, even after nine years of solid riding I only consider myself an experienced rider not an expert at all. And I'm still paying the price for the learning curve. My thesis is posted in this same section of the forum on the subject
[b][size=2]Now on the subject of experience if you have 5 -10 years of experience on dirt bikes, just off roading it, you have not developed the skills necessary to climb on a high performance street bike, drag bike or a track bike. Yes, you've got the basic fundamentals down balance, throttle control, breaking and turning, but these methods are vastly different from the methods employed on a track bike. Now even the handling characteristics of sport bikes are different in different class sizes. Lets say you have been riding an R6 and you trade up to day for a hayabusa and you go out and try to flick it on your favorite twisty at the same pace you just took your R6 through the day before, you'll find it running a lot wider in the corner, or H@LL let's back it up one step and climb on a mid-90s CBR 1000 and try to run it at that curve at the same speed. You may very well find yourself bouncing across the pavement. The weight and power characteristics and length of the bike play a vital role in how well it will corner and braking characteristics will be different so even experience is not really experience. Every bike has its own learning curve. How aggressively you learn that curve is at your own peril. But anyone who starts off on a 1000 or larger bike is most like suffering for a ego problems, but a few individuals possess the maturity to start off on a 1000 and respect it enough to keep from severely injuring themselves I know 1 person years ago,

 

You've created a no-win situation. Of coursethey wouldn't be better off with a different bike at that instant. Most people wouldn't be. Hell, even experienced guys panic at the wrong time.

You have to envision a scenario where a guy is on the wrong bike before everything is about to go wrong. The deeper issue is whether there is a such thing as "the wrong bike" for any given rider. I think there is. And I think in most cases, the wrong bike is too large a displacement.

 

Wait, I just saw this...

Are you implying that you are too good to wreck? That's a dangerous attitude, my friend.

...and I don't think it's all about the rider. It's a combination of rider and bike. There is a such thing as "the wrong bike" for somebody. You can't tell me that you would ride great on every machine out there.

 

I didn't say i can't wreck, don't put words in my mouth. I said thus far, no crashes. Not that i won't, but if i do, i wear leather 100% of the time. That's a risk im willing to take obviously.

I agree i wouldn't ride great on every machine. At the same time you can take 2 guys and throw them into the same corner too hot and 1 will stand it up and brake hard, the other will roll on and lean into it. A rider makes the difference, along with education (willingness to learn).

 

I just have a few points. First, a common mistake of a new rider is to get the throttle, brake, clutch thing screwed up in a panic or at slow speeds. I know I did it...I know my wife did it. On a 1000cc bike you are going to twelve o'clock at best and on a 250 there is considerabley less immediate response. Second, for those who think after a few months of rideing, they are ready to outgrow a six hunny and go to a litre, you need to consider something. The largest percentage of accidents happen to those who have been riding six months or less. The next segment are riders with two-three years of experience. That may be from complacency, but it may also may be from individuals thinking they have more ability than they thought. It may be from the riders who figured the 600's are too slow. I know that if I want a litre bike, I have to ask myself if I push my 600 to its maximum capacity the majority of the time. I can't think of a time when I will answer yes to that question.

 

Not Flaming on, You Just Want to Point a Few Things out from Experienced over Aggressiveness and Willingness to Lean with Poor Technique or Riding beyond the Capability of Your Equipment Will Put Your *** on the Pavement. Speaking from Experience. Full Leather with CE Hard Armored Will Not Protect You from Broken Bones. Speaking from Experience.I Have a Nonparticipating License. Years Ago Ran the WERA Circuit For A Minute Wished I Had the Time, Learned More about How to Handle a Bike. In One Month Than I Had Learned in Five Years of Riding Suggest You Pick Something like WERE Don't Know Exactly Where You're at but It Will Be Good for You. Speaking from Experience and I have probably 100,000 miles in three countries riding in Europe and South America IS a hell of a lot differencethen riding here

 

No, no, no... I said you're implying that you're too good to wreck. It seems like you think you are. You're cocky. Not good. Not healthy.

 

Is it wrong to say that someone that was raised as a kid that interacted on a motor bike (dirt bike) would automatically have more experience than some one that was raised with a father that hated the sound of those two-strokes making it impossible for his kid to gain any experience on a motor bike?

I think so...many of my buds know their **** off road, and I think that directly relates to road handling to a point. They know limits that someone like me hasn’t even encountered. I know that I’m going to encourage my little girl to get on a little 50 when she learns to ride a pedal bike. Not trying to kill her, I just figure that things heal better when their young and I what her to be able to kick *** by the time she’s in her teens.

 

That sounds great Hardcorp. Your points are valid and i acknowledge them, althought i don't push my personal limits often. Most of my riding is indeed twisties in the mountains, but im usually doing the speed limit. That is also probably why im still alive to say it comes down to the rider

Madgreek im not cocky at all in person, it's probably just text and my poor english. I'm well aware i can crash everyday, and dress for it the best i can. Im saying in the same breath that educating yourself on riding technique and positioning can do a lot to keep you from wrecking. Education is very important in any area of life. A newbie that puts in an effort to learn has a much better chance then the one that does not. Cockyness is what gets people in trouble, i speak on the subject the way i do because when i got into this scene i wanted to learn as much as possible to better my chances of beating the statistics. I speak this way because im educated on the subject of riding. I may crash today, i certainly hope not, but i don't count it out.

 

I can see that a noob can get himself into trouble by buying a bike that is beyond his capabilities. I think any bike may be beyond a noobs capabilities until they are prepared to accept the responsibility of being a safe rider. Once that happens, I think the noob can probably safely ride any bike and is well on his way to not being a noob anymore. I don't think there is some cutoff of how slow a bike has to be for it to be safe or unsafe.

I'm willing to compromise here and agree with Madgreek that it is the combination of bike and rider that causes the problem.

Maybe there is some formula for this to rationalize it. Like if on a scale of one to ten, your bike should match your propensity for getting yourself into trouble. So noobs can start at high numbers even with little skill, if they ride defensively, and can start at a higher level of bike. But if a noob is gung-ho about being an irresponsible rider than he has to start low. So the guy who is an 8, and has good sense about him and is very unlikely to get himself into trouble, can start on an 8 bike, like a tame liter (if that exists). Hence a noob that has little sense and is a 1 should start out on a bike that is a 1, like any kawasaki (oohhhh, face)or a 250 or something with little propensity for damaging the individual on it. And the average 5 can start on an average 5 bike.