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Cam Chain Tensioner Question

  #1  
Old 05-04-2014, 01:59 AM
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Default Cam Chain Tensioner Question

About a month ago, I started hearing a rattling noise from my engine when cold. It goes away once the engine warms up. I figured it was the cam chain so I took a quick look at it to see if I could get a screwdriver in there to try this quick fix
Anyway, turns out the previous owner had installed a manual cct. So my question is: since the cct is such an adventure to get access to, would I be better off replacing the manual cct with the stock part from honda (I see that the original part number for the cct has been discontinued and replaced by a different part number, so has honda fixed whatever bug caused the original cct to fail?)? Or, would I save myself the trouble of having to replace the cct again in the future by keeping the manual cct, and completely dismantling my bike every 8000 miles to adjust it (does anyone have a method for adjusting the manual cct that is LESS of a pain than just replacing it altogether?)?
 

Last edited by romoses4; 05-04-2014 at 02:59 PM.
  #2  
Old 05-04-2014, 06:53 AM
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so the short answer is yes honda have fixed the oem tensioner and yes they still fail after 1/2 a year or so. Done all sort of mod to mine, rebuild, grease and that thing in the video above. The point is once they fail, they fail, that mod above will work for first 5 minutes, then you will get rattle again!
I have gone through 2 set of the oem tensioner and got manual now.
IMO you better of just adjust yours and save yourself some money. It takes about the same time for a oem one to fail in compare MCCT that get out of tune.
 
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Old 05-04-2014, 01:01 PM
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Ok great, that's what I was looking for. Thanks!
 
  #4  
Old 05-04-2014, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by icedmind View Post
so the short answer is yes honda have fixed the oem tensioner and yes they still fail after 1/2 a year or so. Done all sort of mod to mine, rebuild, grease and that thing in the video above. The point is once they fail, they fail, that mod above will work for first 5 minutes, then you will get rattle again!
I have gone through 2 set of the oem tensioner and got manual now.
IMO you better of just adjust yours and save yourself some money. It takes about the same time for a oem one to fail in compare MCCT that get out of tune.
Im sorry, but did you just say that all the new ones fail after 6 months?
 
  #5  
Old 05-04-2014, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by PossibleOne View Post
Im sorry, but did you just say that all the new ones fail after 6 months?
yep, the last one was replaced last june just before I went touring around Germany and starting to have problem just after christmas, and it got worse and went to a mcct after countless amount of rebuild, doing the screwdriver fix...

thats did cover about 10,000 miles tho
 
  #6  
Old 05-04-2014, 02:39 PM
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Damn, because from what I read and what not I heard that they did come out with a new OEM part and that it wasnt even close to the fail rate of the original OEM. Kind of disheartening to hear that even those dont last. I havent done mine yet, but my bike has 19k on it and its just a matter of time. From what I can tell the PO didnt do it on it either. Thanks for the heads up. Would be cool to get some other people in here to talk about the replacement. Everyone always talks about the one failing, but dont hear near as much about it after that and I was assuming thats because it was working, and when things go right, you dont really hear about it.
 
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Old 05-05-2014, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by PossibleOne View Post
Damn, because from what I read and what not I heard that they did come out with a new OEM part and that it wasnt even close to the fail rate of the original OEM. Kind of disheartening to hear that even those dont last. I havent done mine yet, but my bike has 19k on it and its just a matter of time. From what I can tell the PO didnt do it on it either. Thanks for the heads up. Would be cool to get some other people in here to talk about the replacement. Everyone always talks about the one failing, but dont hear near as much about it after that and I was assuming thats because it was working, and when things go right, you dont really hear about it.
yea these cam chain tensioner are always the weak link of modern bikes, mainly because the high rev range they go up to and its simply impossible for the manufacture to come up with something that not just last forever but also perform well in track like environment or abuse should I say.

The design itself is very cleaver where it keep the chain tensioned at different rev range by using a spring and giving it "dynamic load" where it needs it.
The problem is on the point where the CCT sits in and with it only moving a little bit, it wears off the surface and stop it form working, hence the noise on 5k,10k and 12k. *well thats my understanding of it, I could be wrong*
 
  #8  
Old 05-05-2014, 09:25 PM
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They revised the oem part twice since it came out. They last me about 15k miles before they rattle, then I run them another 15k or so before I change them [same time I do my valves] They rattle but seem to work fine. At 62k I put in the bikes 3rd tensioner [oem plus I replaced once before at 31k] and it seems to be rattling slightly already at 65k. If it gets any worse I think I'll finally give up and get a manual one.
 
  #9  
Old 05-08-2014, 02:04 PM
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So I ended up simply adjusting my manual tensioner. Kind of a pain in the ***; had to bend a couple wrenches (don't try this at home), but in the end I got it done and the bike sounds much happier. Btw, icedmind, I don't mean to flame all over you because this seems to be a common misconception (I've seen it all over this forum), but the stock cam chain tensioner does not provide "dynamic load" as you called it. Since you've replaced yours a few times, I'm sure you've taken a minute to see how it works. Basically, it's an infinitely variable ratchet. The spring inside serves only to increase the tension on the cam chain as it stretches. Once the tension is increased, that's it, it's stuck. The pushrod in the tensioner is pushed out over time by the internal spring to take up the slack in the cam chain but will NEVER go back into the tensioner. (Unless you stick a screwdriver in there and twist it to release the ratchet mechanism and suck the pushrod back into the unit to relieve the tension)
 
  #10  
Old 05-08-2014, 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by romoses4 View Post
So I ended up simply adjusting my manual tensioner. Kind of a pain in the ***; had to bend a couple wrenches (don't try this at home), but in the end I got it done and the bike sounds much happier. Btw, icedmind, I don't mean to flame all over you because this seems to be a common misconception (I've seen it all over this forum), but the stock cam chain tensioner does not provide "dynamic load" as you called it. Since you've replaced yours a few times, I'm sure you've taken a minute to see how it works. Basically, it's an infinitely variable ratchet. The spring inside serves only to increase the tension on the cam chain as it stretches. Once the tension is increased, that's it, it's stuck. The pushrod in the tensioner is pushed out over time by the internal spring to take up the slack in the cam chain but will NEVER go back into the tensioner. (Unless you stick a screwdriver in there and twist it to release the ratchet mechanism and suck the pushrod back into the unit to relieve the tension)
Yea I understand that part but with the honda cam chain tensioner theres no push rod, the coil spring put twisting motion into the worm screw to push the cam chain tensioner out; unlike others like suzuki ones etc used spring load ratchet.

Theres a post form other forum or here I read, if you put the screwdriver on the end of the cam chain tensioner when installed, start the bike and rev it slowly through the rev range, you will see the screw driver turn; this was on a black bird? (i think or other honda model) with a identical design CCT.
I could be wrong but thats where the information came from.
 
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