93 CBR F2 temperature problem?
#11
11-29-2013 | 01:44 PM
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#13
12-03-2013 | 09:17 AM
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From: Omaha, Nebraska
Very, Very nice! Rare we see that bike in such great shape. My bike had a similar history, where an owner let it sit for years. Still ran great. When it got to me (3rd owner), it ran fantastic for about 2 weeks. That's when it started to run real funny. Hard to start, would miss until it was very warm (because one of the jets was almost completely clogged). Would sputter at low rpm and acceleration just wasn't all there. This is most definitely because the carbs hadn't been gone through for who knows how many years. The rectifier was also 90% completely fried. But whatever your issue is, it's probably pretty simple. This is what happens to just about any man made mechanical device, even electronics. You let them sit unused for a long time and things become stiff, have a tendancy to seize up or don't work at all when you go to use them again.
#14
12-03-2013 | 08:10 PM
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I have three photos, but apparently how it posted the links it will only show one. I also wanted to know if i have to sync the carbs if i take them apart, cause the sync tools are pretty expensive and i'm hoping i don't have to get that now lol. I'm waiting on getting the thermostat too, then i'll post some updates
#15
12-04-2013 | 08:20 AM
Welcome Crew and ROTY 2014
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From: Kansas
Keep it simple... there is no need to separate the carbs from one another, when cleaning, and regarding a sync, there's no need to do one, if there are no obvious symptoms showing that it's necessary. 
If, after you've cleaned the carbs thoroughly, and I mean thoroughly, removing and soaking all of the jets and pilot screws, and making sure all the associated passages in the carb bodies are clean - if after this, you have issues with a high idle, or it's idling inconsistently, even after getting them clean, set as close to the right baseline as possible, and don't have a vacuum leak anywhere, then you might look into a sync, but more often then not, a sync is not necessary... as long as nobody has intentionally monkeyed around with the individual throttle plate adjustments, you'll likely be fine.
One thing you can do, to see if there are any glaring discrepancies in the throttle plate settings, from one carb to another, is simply use some feeler gauges to get an idea how close they are matched up.
Pick a feeler gauge size, as close as possible to the current space between the throttle plates and venturis, and use the idle adjustment screw to move the plate open or closed, so that it lightly grazes the feeler gauge, but not so much that you have to be foreceful to slide the gauge underneath the butterfly, or back out.
Then, use the same feeler gauge on the remaining butterflies, to verify the fitting is the same for the rest.
Using a sync tool is more precise for getting them absolutely perfectly synced, as it will compensate for potential slight differences in compression from one cylinder to the next, but it is rare for there to be a need to consider this, and you should be able to just assume that all factors are equal for each cylinder - if they are, then using the feeler gauges properly will get you plenty close enough to perfect.
Good luck!
If, after you've cleaned the carbs thoroughly, and I mean thoroughly, removing and soaking all of the jets and pilot screws, and making sure all the associated passages in the carb bodies are clean - if after this, you have issues with a high idle, or it's idling inconsistently, even after getting them clean, set as close to the right baseline as possible, and don't have a vacuum leak anywhere, then you might look into a sync, but more often then not, a sync is not necessary... as long as nobody has intentionally monkeyed around with the individual throttle plate adjustments, you'll likely be fine.
One thing you can do, to see if there are any glaring discrepancies in the throttle plate settings, from one carb to another, is simply use some feeler gauges to get an idea how close they are matched up.
Pick a feeler gauge size, as close as possible to the current space between the throttle plates and venturis, and use the idle adjustment screw to move the plate open or closed, so that it lightly grazes the feeler gauge, but not so much that you have to be foreceful to slide the gauge underneath the butterfly, or back out.
Then, use the same feeler gauge on the remaining butterflies, to verify the fitting is the same for the rest.
Using a sync tool is more precise for getting them absolutely perfectly synced, as it will compensate for potential slight differences in compression from one cylinder to the next, but it is rare for there to be a need to consider this, and you should be able to just assume that all factors are equal for each cylinder - if they are, then using the feeler gauges properly will get you plenty close enough to perfect.
Good luck!
#16
12-13-2013 | 07:32 AM
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Well, updates will be a little delayed because when i was riding yesterday the oil drain plug apparently rattled lose and drained the oil when i stopped and had the bike off, luckily i noticed it on the tire. It seems the actual drain bolt was messed up just were the washer is, and the washer is stuck on the bolt. So i'll be buying a new drain bolt and double check it's just the oil drain plug which i'm fairly positive it is, and then i'll give some updates on progress with the thermostat eventually. I also was reading about a pair control valve, and heard it causes popping on decel with aftermarket exhausts (the bike has a full exhaust system) and i was wondering if i took that off and capped the space were the pcv was would that work? or would that cause problems.
#17
12-13-2013 | 11:37 AM
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From: Kansas
On the drain bolt, the washer is supposed to be "captive", in other words, it should not come off the bolt, anyway, you've got to replace it so, that really doesn't matter... then again, does it need to be replaced? If all it did was vibrate loose, because the last person to put it in didn't torque it to spec, then that would be all you need to do. Torque spec for that bolt is 27 ft. lb.
The PAIR system was not introduced until the F3, unless they were putting them on California F2s - I really don't know for sure but I don't think they even did that on CA bikes, but I have never worked on one, so you should verify that.
Popping on decel is usually a symptom of your pilot circuit being lean, so when/if you clean the carbs: a) the issue might be resolved with the cleaning, as there maybe gummed up fuel or other blockage, essentially leaning the pilot circuit, and others, or, b) once cleaned, if you're still getting popping on decel, you might just have to richen your pilot circuit by 1/8 turn at a time until it goes away.
For your bike, your baseline pilot screw settings should be 2 1/8 turn out, if it's a 49-state bike, but with a slip-on and hi-flow air filter (hopefully clean), you might start at 2 1/4, or even 2 1/2... make sure when you go to clean the carbs, before you remove the pilot screws for cleaning them, and the passages, you turn each screw in, counting the number of turns it takes to get each one lightly seated, and record that number.
The PAIR system was not introduced until the F3, unless they were putting them on California F2s - I really don't know for sure but I don't think they even did that on CA bikes, but I have never worked on one, so you should verify that.
Popping on decel is usually a symptom of your pilot circuit being lean, so when/if you clean the carbs: a) the issue might be resolved with the cleaning, as there maybe gummed up fuel or other blockage, essentially leaning the pilot circuit, and others, or, b) once cleaned, if you're still getting popping on decel, you might just have to richen your pilot circuit by 1/8 turn at a time until it goes away.
For your bike, your baseline pilot screw settings should be 2 1/8 turn out, if it's a 49-state bike, but with a slip-on and hi-flow air filter (hopefully clean), you might start at 2 1/4, or even 2 1/2... make sure when you go to clean the carbs, before you remove the pilot screws for cleaning them, and the passages, you turn each screw in, counting the number of turns it takes to get each one lightly seated, and record that number.
Last edited by JNSRacing; 12-14-2013 at 12:00 PM.
#18
12-14-2013 | 09:30 AM
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From: Marietta GA
After buying more bike's than i can ride at one time , mostly older sport bikes,
i have found that any bike that has been sitting for some time really needs to be gone though, my buddy got a 94 f2 last yr. we had to go over the whole bike, replace brake line, pads, tires, plugs, clean the carbs, put a jet kit in (didn't have one) with a aftermarket pipe, we have found that the best way to get the carbs , is to use a ULTRASONIC CLEANER best money you can spend,
His bike looks as good if not better than yours , CA model, low mile 13,000 but had been sitting, we change all fluids, the radiator had only water in it , It also had so much rust in it that it had to be replaced.
I would get a factory manual and start to go over the bike from start to finish and do all of the service , check everything, then after that i would find someone to dyno it, my f2 i thought was running good then i put it on a dyno and found that it was only making 80 hp and was running so rich it would have fire coming out the pipe when he was changing gears. smoked at high rpm's , right now i have the head off , (valve job)
good luck mike
i have found that any bike that has been sitting for some time really needs to be gone though, my buddy got a 94 f2 last yr. we had to go over the whole bike, replace brake line, pads, tires, plugs, clean the carbs, put a jet kit in (didn't have one) with a aftermarket pipe, we have found that the best way to get the carbs , is to use a ULTRASONIC CLEANER best money you can spend,
His bike looks as good if not better than yours , CA model, low mile 13,000 but had been sitting, we change all fluids, the radiator had only water in it , It also had so much rust in it that it had to be replaced.
I would get a factory manual and start to go over the bike from start to finish and do all of the service , check everything, then after that i would find someone to dyno it, my f2 i thought was running good then i put it on a dyno and found that it was only making 80 hp and was running so rich it would have fire coming out the pipe when he was changing gears. smoked at high rpm's , right now i have the head off , (valve job)
good luck mike
#19
12-17-2013 | 08:37 PM
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Well guys, i just drained the oil, it had coolant in it as well as coolant in the radiator having oil in it. So i suspect the head gasket needs to be replaced. So going to be a bit more work then i originally thought to get this thing going again. Does anyone know if i have to drop the motor to get to the gasket?
