Transmission problems. Please help w/ ideas
#11
08-04-2012, 05:56 PM
Here is my current project on my F3 (https://cbrforum.com/forum/cbr-600f3...-ol-f3-139381/)
I built the tool to split the engine halves which allowed me to split the cases in a couple seconds. The gears you need to replace might be different than mine, but the Gears I am replacing are (M = Mainshaft ; C = Countershaft) C1, C2, C3, C4, M5, and M6. These gears have signs of wear/damage which allow causes the slipping out of gear problem. I'm ordering mine through ronayers.com. To complete remove the gears from their shafts, you need a pair of pliers called duckbill pliers ( ). When you take the tranny apart, it has to go together EXACTLY the way it came apart. Most of the parts are directional. The easiest thing to do is put the parts onto a rod to hold direction and order of your parts.
I built the tool to split the engine halves which allowed me to split the cases in a couple seconds. The gears you need to replace might be different than mine, but the Gears I am replacing are (M = Mainshaft ; C = Countershaft) C1, C2, C3, C4, M5, and M6. These gears have signs of wear/damage which allow causes the slipping out of gear problem. I'm ordering mine through ronayers.com. To complete remove the gears from their shafts, you need a pair of pliers called duckbill pliers ( ). When you take the tranny apart, it has to go together EXACTLY the way it came apart. Most of the parts are directional. The easiest thing to do is put the parts onto a rod to hold direction and order of your parts.
Last edited by marc0011; 08-04-2012 at 06:50 PM.
#12
08-04-2012, 06:12 PM
Price: Depends on your wallet size
These are all things that crews do to bikes on the track. However they have sponsors and usually fat wallets to pay for it. It would cost you ALOT! If your looking for bolt on performance then price is still high but not nearly the price of internal motor work. I suggest ngk iridium plugs, aftermarket sprockets(+/- depending on if you want top speed or torque), clutch plates and springs, aftermarket exhaust(research hp gains online), run midgrade - premium gas, aftermarket pads, and something that makes a big difference... lose some weight. Lookup some wheels and if you dont ride someone then chop the tail end. You could also look at new fairings that are light weight plastic instead of fiberglass. Eating better would help too :P
Last edited by IanCBR600F3; 08-04-2012 at 06:14 PM.
#13
08-06-2012, 06:28 AM
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
marc:
I checked out your project and it had some great pointers. However, do you know anywhere there is a complete write up on a project like this or are you just following a manual? I would just like a more step by step perspective on the project. Also can you let me know how you built the tool to split the engine? And finally the link you gave to amazon is for lock ring pliers, is that the same as the duckbill pliers you were saying i would need? Also I may have to steal your idea for putting the bolts in the cardboard, very creative!
Ian:
I already have the iridium plugs, a k&n air filter, just actually ordered my sprockets the other day (-1,+2), and for the exhaust im just running a shorty pipe that someone stuck on so its very loud but I'm thinking pretty close to a performance pipe because it has no baffles to go through like a normal exhaust, always run premium gas, and i weigh only around 180 so that aint bad. Was thinking about the new fairings though cuz mine are getting kinda rough and gotta keep the backseat for the wife lol. I was kind of wondering about maybe jetting the carbs but I am unsure if they have ever been done before, is there a way to tell if they have, and if they haven't been jetted how hard a project is that? Ive already had the carbs off and cleaned out the floats, but didn't really mess with the jets. And any recommendations on what is the best clutch and springs to get? I figured now with pulling the engine it would be a good time to do the clutch.
Thanks again guys for all your help!
I checked out your project and it had some great pointers. However, do you know anywhere there is a complete write up on a project like this or are you just following a manual? I would just like a more step by step perspective on the project. Also can you let me know how you built the tool to split the engine? And finally the link you gave to amazon is for lock ring pliers, is that the same as the duckbill pliers you were saying i would need? Also I may have to steal your idea for putting the bolts in the cardboard, very creative!
Ian:
I already have the iridium plugs, a k&n air filter, just actually ordered my sprockets the other day (-1,+2), and for the exhaust im just running a shorty pipe that someone stuck on so its very loud but I'm thinking pretty close to a performance pipe because it has no baffles to go through like a normal exhaust, always run premium gas, and i weigh only around 180 so that aint bad. Was thinking about the new fairings though cuz mine are getting kinda rough and gotta keep the backseat for the wife lol. I was kind of wondering about maybe jetting the carbs but I am unsure if they have ever been done before, is there a way to tell if they have, and if they haven't been jetted how hard a project is that? Ive already had the carbs off and cleaned out the floats, but didn't really mess with the jets. And any recommendations on what is the best clutch and springs to get? I figured now with pulling the engine it would be a good time to do the clutch.
Thanks again guys for all your help!
#14
08-07-2012, 02:22 PM
I'm not using a manual yet, but I'll need it for torque values when assembling. Here are some things you'll need, a way to lift the bike, floor jack, and tie downs. I use a cherry picker to lift the bike frame up off the engine and support it with a floor jack. After I've pulled the frame away, I stabilize the engine. You can muscle the thing around by hand, but it's REALLY nice to have two people moving it to your disassembly location/bench. Here is the best I can give you for step by step. To start off, you will need to remove all fairings and the battery.
1. Remove chain. You can do this by removing the front drive sprocket cover and then hitting the sprocket bolt with an impact wrench. After you've removed the sprocket, just let the chain hang on the swing arm.
2. Remove the airbox and then the carbs. It sounds like you've done this before and so it shouldn't be that big of deal.
3. Remove the exhaust from the headers back.
4. Drain the coolant from the engine. Pull off the radiator cap. Pull out the drain bolt from the water pump (left side right in front of the shifter). The drain bolt is just under the big hose housing going to the radiator. After you've drained as much as you can from there, disconnect the radiator hoses and remove the (don't forget to unplug the fan) radiator and hoses.
5. Drain the oil.
6. unplug the electrical connectors located right in front of the battery. These are for the stator, side stand, ignition pulse generator, speed sensor, and neutral switch. You will need to undo some harness clamps so that the wires are free of the frame. Just trace back from the battery box and you'll see the clamps I'm talking about on the right side of the sub frame. You will also need to disconnect the three pronged connector on the out side of frame on the right side.
7. Disconnect the starter motor from the starter relay.
8. Disconnect the spark plug boots and then remove the coils. Life is just easier with them outa your way. Be sure to keeps tabs on which wire goes where from the engine harness. The OEM plug wires are numbered for you, so you don't have to worry about them.
9. Disconnect the clutch cable.
10. Remove the left and right black engine hangers. You can thread the bolts back in with the spacers on them too. Helps to keep things in order.
11. Remove the shift linkage from the shift shaft. I usually take the rearset off too just to get the whole assembly out of my way.
12. Get the bike in a vertical position. I do this with the cherry picker and tie downs. Now you can support the engine.
13. Remove the lower engine bolt by removing the nut and then pulling the bolt out. On the right, there is a locking mechanism. Loosen the chrome locking nut and then you'll need a 10mm allen wrench to back out the piece that is threaded into the frame off the engine casing.
14. Remove the two front engine hanger bolts and shims. These shims are specific to the sides they go on.
15. Remove the last engine bolt. Remove the nut and then the bolt should pull out. It might be a little tough being how it's the last one. There is also a metal shim on the right side.
16. Lift the frame up and off the engine and set it on the ground.
17. Stabilize the engine and get it over to your bench.
I'll put in a step by step on the next bit, engine tear down. FYI, there are four blade like points of contact the come down off the oil pan. You can sit the engine down on these. Just be sure you set it down on a block of wood. The engine could fall forward, so you'll want to brace it. I also used these to stabilize the engine when I was pulling it out. DO NOT use the oil cooler or oil filter as points to support engine weight.
1. Remove chain. You can do this by removing the front drive sprocket cover and then hitting the sprocket bolt with an impact wrench. After you've removed the sprocket, just let the chain hang on the swing arm.
2. Remove the airbox and then the carbs. It sounds like you've done this before and so it shouldn't be that big of deal.
3. Remove the exhaust from the headers back.
4. Drain the coolant from the engine. Pull off the radiator cap. Pull out the drain bolt from the water pump (left side right in front of the shifter). The drain bolt is just under the big hose housing going to the radiator. After you've drained as much as you can from there, disconnect the radiator hoses and remove the (don't forget to unplug the fan) radiator and hoses.
5. Drain the oil.
6. unplug the electrical connectors located right in front of the battery. These are for the stator, side stand, ignition pulse generator, speed sensor, and neutral switch. You will need to undo some harness clamps so that the wires are free of the frame. Just trace back from the battery box and you'll see the clamps I'm talking about on the right side of the sub frame. You will also need to disconnect the three pronged connector on the out side of frame on the right side.
7. Disconnect the starter motor from the starter relay.
8. Disconnect the spark plug boots and then remove the coils. Life is just easier with them outa your way. Be sure to keeps tabs on which wire goes where from the engine harness. The OEM plug wires are numbered for you, so you don't have to worry about them.
9. Disconnect the clutch cable.
10. Remove the left and right black engine hangers. You can thread the bolts back in with the spacers on them too. Helps to keep things in order.
11. Remove the shift linkage from the shift shaft. I usually take the rearset off too just to get the whole assembly out of my way.
12. Get the bike in a vertical position. I do this with the cherry picker and tie downs. Now you can support the engine.
13. Remove the lower engine bolt by removing the nut and then pulling the bolt out. On the right, there is a locking mechanism. Loosen the chrome locking nut and then you'll need a 10mm allen wrench to back out the piece that is threaded into the frame off the engine casing.
14. Remove the two front engine hanger bolts and shims. These shims are specific to the sides they go on.
15. Remove the last engine bolt. Remove the nut and then the bolt should pull out. It might be a little tough being how it's the last one. There is also a metal shim on the right side.
16. Lift the frame up and off the engine and set it on the ground.
17. Stabilize the engine and get it over to your bench.
I'll put in a step by step on the next bit, engine tear down. FYI, there are four blade like points of contact the come down off the oil pan. You can sit the engine down on these. Just be sure you set it down on a block of wood. The engine could fall forward, so you'll want to brace it. I also used these to stabilize the engine when I was pulling it out. DO NOT use the oil cooler or oil filter as points to support engine weight.
#15
08-07-2012, 02:57 PM
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: newcastle
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
#16
08-07-2012, 03:55 PM
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Marc:
Thank you so much for the great information, and i will be looking forward to your post on the step by step instructions. My only questions is when you say get the bike vertical , do you actually mean have the bike lifted into the air with the back tire close to the ground and the front tire directly above it almost plumb like a string?
Thank you so much for the great information, and i will be looking forward to your post on the step by step instructions. My only questions is when you say get the bike vertical , do you actually mean have the bike lifted into the air with the back tire close to the ground and the front tire directly above it almost plumb like a string?
#17
08-07-2012, 10:23 PM
I'm not using a manual yet, but I'll need it for torque values when assembling. Here are some things you'll need, a way to lift the bike, floor jack, and tie downs. I use a cherry picker to lift the bike frame up off the engine and support it with a floor jack. After I've pulled the frame away, I stabilize the engine. You can muscle the thing around by hand, but it's REALLY nice to have two people moving it to your disassembly location/bench. Here is the best I can give you for step by step. To start off, you will need to remove all fairings and the battery.
1. Remove chain. You can do this by removing the front drive sprocket cover and then hitting the sprocket bolt with an impact wrench. After you've removed the sprocket, just let the chain hang on the swing arm.
2. Remove the airbox and then the carbs. It sounds like you've done this before and so it shouldn't be that big of deal.
3. Remove the exhaust from the headers back.
4. Drain the coolant from the engine. Pull off the radiator cap. Pull out the drain bolt from the water pump (left side right in front of the shifter). The drain bolt is just under the big hose housing going to the radiator. After you've drained as much as you can from there, disconnect the radiator hoses and remove the (don't forget to unplug the fan) radiator and hoses.
5. Drain the oil.
6. unplug the electrical connectors located right in front of the battery. These are for the stator, side stand, ignition pulse generator, speed sensor, and neutral switch. You will need to undo some harness clamps so that the wires are free of the frame. Just trace back from the battery box and you'll see the clamps I'm talking about on the right side of the sub frame. You will also need to disconnect the three pronged connector on the out side of frame on the right side.
7. Disconnect the starter motor from the starter relay.
8. Disconnect the spark plug boots and then remove the coils. Life is just easier with them outa your way. Be sure to keeps tabs on which wire goes where from the engine harness. The OEM plug wires are numbered for you, so you don't have to worry about them.
9. Disconnect the clutch cable.
10. Remove the left and right black engine hangers. You can thread the bolts back in with the spacers on them too. Helps to keep things in order.
11. Remove the shift linkage from the shift shaft. I usually take the rearset off too just to get the whole assembly out of my way.
12. Get the bike in a vertical position. I do this with the cherry picker and tie downs. Now you can support the engine.
13. Remove the lower engine bolt by removing the nut and then pulling the bolt out. On the right, there is a locking mechanism. Loosen the chrome locking nut and then you'll need a 10mm allen wrench to back out the piece that is threaded into the frame off the engine casing.
14. Remove the two front engine hanger bolts and shims. These shims are specific to the sides they go on.
15. Remove the last engine bolt. Remove the nut and then the bolt should pull out. It might be a little tough being how it's the last one. There is also a metal shim on the right side.
16. Lift the frame up and off the engine and set it on the ground.
17. Stabilize the engine and get it over to your bench.
I'll put in a step by step on the next bit, engine tear down. FYI, there are four blade like points of contact the come down off the oil pan. You can sit the engine down on these. Just be sure you set it down on a block of wood. The engine could fall forward, so you'll want to brace it. I also used these to stabilize the engine when I was pulling it out. DO NOT use the oil cooler or oil filter as points to support engine weight.
1. Remove chain. You can do this by removing the front drive sprocket cover and then hitting the sprocket bolt with an impact wrench. After you've removed the sprocket, just let the chain hang on the swing arm.
2. Remove the airbox and then the carbs. It sounds like you've done this before and so it shouldn't be that big of deal.
3. Remove the exhaust from the headers back.
4. Drain the coolant from the engine. Pull off the radiator cap. Pull out the drain bolt from the water pump (left side right in front of the shifter). The drain bolt is just under the big hose housing going to the radiator. After you've drained as much as you can from there, disconnect the radiator hoses and remove the (don't forget to unplug the fan) radiator and hoses.
5. Drain the oil.
6. unplug the electrical connectors located right in front of the battery. These are for the stator, side stand, ignition pulse generator, speed sensor, and neutral switch. You will need to undo some harness clamps so that the wires are free of the frame. Just trace back from the battery box and you'll see the clamps I'm talking about on the right side of the sub frame. You will also need to disconnect the three pronged connector on the out side of frame on the right side.
7. Disconnect the starter motor from the starter relay.
8. Disconnect the spark plug boots and then remove the coils. Life is just easier with them outa your way. Be sure to keeps tabs on which wire goes where from the engine harness. The OEM plug wires are numbered for you, so you don't have to worry about them.
9. Disconnect the clutch cable.
10. Remove the left and right black engine hangers. You can thread the bolts back in with the spacers on them too. Helps to keep things in order.
11. Remove the shift linkage from the shift shaft. I usually take the rearset off too just to get the whole assembly out of my way.
12. Get the bike in a vertical position. I do this with the cherry picker and tie downs. Now you can support the engine.
13. Remove the lower engine bolt by removing the nut and then pulling the bolt out. On the right, there is a locking mechanism. Loosen the chrome locking nut and then you'll need a 10mm allen wrench to back out the piece that is threaded into the frame off the engine casing.
14. Remove the two front engine hanger bolts and shims. These shims are specific to the sides they go on.
15. Remove the last engine bolt. Remove the nut and then the bolt should pull out. It might be a little tough being how it's the last one. There is also a metal shim on the right side.
16. Lift the frame up and off the engine and set it on the ground.
17. Stabilize the engine and get it over to your bench.
I'll put in a step by step on the next bit, engine tear down. FYI, there are four blade like points of contact the come down off the oil pan. You can sit the engine down on these. Just be sure you set it down on a block of wood. The engine could fall forward, so you'll want to brace it. I also used these to stabilize the engine when I was pulling it out. DO NOT use the oil cooler or oil filter as points to support engine weight.
+1
#18
08-08-2012, 10:35 PM
Here is what I am talking about supporting the bike. I'm in the process of repainting my frame, so I removed the swing arm and forks. You can see how I supported the engine from below and how I'm using the cherry picker to pull the frame off the engine.
http://nw08.american.edu/~schrader/pict0037_alt.jpg
http://nw08.american.edu/~schrader/pict0034_alt.jpg
p.s. I am having issues embedding images here. Where can I find the option to embed images with URL or from an uploaded photo.
http://nw08.american.edu/~schrader/pict0037_alt.jpg
http://nw08.american.edu/~schrader/pict0034_alt.jpg
p.s. I am having issues embedding images here. Where can I find the option to embed images with URL or from an uploaded photo.
Last edited by marc0011; 08-08-2012 at 10:37 PM.
#19
08-21-2012, 06:48 PM
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have decided to do an engine swap and completed all the steps and believed to have pulled all the engine bolts but the engine still does not seem to want to slide out. I don't know if I have become hung up on something or am missing a bolt somewhere. If Marc or anyone else with prior knowledge of doing this could help I would greatly appreciate it. Also when purchasing my engine I received a Dyna Ignition with it. I am a little confused as to how to hook this up so if someone has hooked one up before and could help with that that would be great. Thanks for all the help everyone!
#20
08-27-2012, 08:19 AM
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 23
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Okay guys I need some serious help. I ended up proceeding with the engine swap and it took about a week between school and work to complete the swap. Well anyways I ended up getting the radiator, air filter box, and gas tank on today and attempted to fire it up before installing the rest of the fairing, and my new sprockets and chain (just incase). Well to my displeasure the bike would not start. It would only repeatedly crank over and over. I am at a loss as what to do next. I checked and the plugs have spark, I believe gas is getting to the carbs. Anyone that could please help with ideas I would greatly appreciate it, I would like to get a few more weeks of riding in and I am at a loss as what to do next about getting the bike to start. So PLEASE Help. Thank you!