Given the amount of new bikes being posted for "parting out" recently, I thought it might be a good idea to require those parting out bikes whole to post a picture of the bike's VIN, along with something unique in the title, like the day's newspaper. I've seen a lot of stolen bikes parted out recently, and I hate to think that I (or anyone on this forum) is supporting thieves, intentionally or not. Could we somehow have this requirement put in place? Or maybe have no 'new' members with no history on the siteposting to part out "their" '07RR's, etc? Just a thought; maybe we could put a dent in the amount of people profiting off our hard-earned machines.

ORIGINAL: klutch_r

Given the amount of new bikes being posted for "parting out" recently, I thought it might be a good idea to require those parting out bikes whole to post a picture of the bike's VIN, along with something unique in the title, like the day's newspaper. I've seen a lot of stolen bikes parted out recently, and I hate to think that I (or anyone on this forum) is supporting thieves, intentionally or not. Could we somehow have this requirement put in place? Or maybe have no 'new' members with no history on the siteposting to part out "their" '07RR's, etc? Just a thought; maybe we could put a dent in the amount of people profiting off our hard-earned machines.



I like this idea. Stricter posting guidelines in the for sale section is a good thing.

Buyer's discretion, no?

My thing is these new members that sign up and are doing this....that's where I think it gets fishy.

My .02--> There are forums out there that don't allow new member's to sell anything until they are considered "established" members based on whatever criteria is outlined by Admins.

Me? I don't ever buy off someone who I haven't seen around any given forum on a consistant basis. That's my own personal rules.

IMO, the threads of that nature should be heavily scrutinized by Admin and maybe the seller should be required to PM a VIN or some kind of proof it's a 100% legal sale.


FWIW: I know for a fact that new bikes can arriveat dealers already totalled due to frame damage, for example. Those bikes can be sold but only with a salvaged title.

Either way, these threads should be scrutinized to the fullest especially if it's a new member.

here here:D

ORIGINAL: bergs

Buyer's discretion, no?

My thing is these new members that sign up and are doing this....that's where I think it gets fishy.

My .02--> There are forums out there that don't allow new member's to sell anything until they are considered "established" members based on whatever criteria is outlined by Admins.

Me? I don't ever buy off someone who I haven't seen around any given forum on a consistant basis. That's my own personal rules.

IMO, the threads of that nature should be heavily scrutinized by Admin and maybe the seller should be required to PM a VIN or some kind of proof it's a 100% legal sale.


FWIW: I know for a fact that new bikes can arriveat dealers already totalled due to frame damage, for example. Those bikes can be sold but only with a salvaged title.

Either way, these threads should be scrutinized to the fullest especially if it's a new member.


Exactly. But not everyone is going to take the moral highground like you say you will.

Here in Vancouver, there's a shop, MSpeed, that got in a lot of trouble a few years back. They were buying a pissload of stolen bikes directly from professional thieves, and stealing some themselves. They would part them out, and sell them piece by piece, especially to the racer scene, and on forums like this. When they were eventually caught, theyhad over 70 bikes in their warehouse. Our provincial insurance agency filed a lawsuit in the high-hundreds of thousands of dollars for the claims on all the stolen bikes, but didn't come close to recovering the millions lost. I think its up to the buyers of parts to prevent and destroy the market for stolen parts. Some people don't care where the parts come from, so long as they're cheap. If we all stand up against this practice and put a little more effort into establishing the origin of used parts, we can help reduce the market for stolen parts.

Yes, there are people out there that are parting out nearly-new bikes, sometimes purchased from a salvage wrecker or insurance claims lot, but the titles still come with the bike, be it a 'rebuilt' or 'salvage' titled bike, and they should still have proof of the sale. I'd just like to see some proof of ownership, or even just a VIN that can be proven to be stamped on the bike in question so we can do our own homework.

The last thing I want to see happening is bikes belonging to members on this forum being stolen and parted out and sold back to us, like what happened in the example I explained.

Not sure if you will ever put a dent in the stolen resale market in general, however I do agree we should make some guidelines, to atleast discourage that type of practice on this forum. I like the idea of new comers not being able to post stuff for sale, like someone else said, I wont buy from someone that hasnt been around for a little while.

As for the VIN number deal, I do not think it is fair to ask the mods to research every vin number that is sent to them. also other than the frame, there is always a way around having the vin number. I bought these rims..fairing...clip ons..etc off ebay or at the track and I dont need them now. The parting out a whole bike things is questionable though

Boy do I agree with this. I think there are enough members here that work at dealers that they could take turns running VIN#s. I just looked at the parting out bikes area and there are several shady postings where the OP makes up a story, then doesn't back it up. If someone is looking to sell many thousands ofdollars worth of parts, they should be able to post a photo of a title and allow a selected group to check on the VIN#. (replacement titlesare easy to get)

Also, I can't believe the scumbags who obviously know or suspect that the bike is/was stolen and they still post what they want or need. I have no respect for those people and hope they trash their new parts the day after they install them on the bike. [:@]

Thought just hit me, but isn't there some way that we could notify the local police department about these parting outs? I don't want it to be in such a way that they (thiefs) don't come back and try to sell. I'm just trying to think of a way to help out. I have a feeling that I didn't convey what I was say.

Basically, can we have an agreement (unspoken) that if someone comes on here to sell something, and a CBR member contacts the thiefabout it trying to get more info. Then if it is stolen, then notify the locals? Rather than having all these members saying it's stolen and that thief never comes back. I'm just trying to think of a way to do something that doesn't throw a huge flag out there, and might just help someone get there bike back.

ORIGINAL: MikeInCtown

Also, I can't believe the scumbags who obviously know or suspect that the bike is/was stolen and they still post what they want or need.


I hope this is not based on my comment about needing a frame in the 1KRR thread.

If so, I was joking. I don't need to ride on anything that has "shady" written on it.

klutch_r- I have those morals only because, IMO,it's bad karma not to.

In my mind I'm risking bodily harm or even deathif I were to knowingly purchase hot parts and ride on them.

Anyone parting out a bike should be REQUIRED to post pics. NO EXCEPTIONS. Moderators should take an active part in killing threads that don't do this.One pic should obviously be of the frame with VIN# showing.

I can't believe the people that buy parts sight unseen!!!!!!!! Bought one time from seller in canada w/o pics and got burned. Never again.

I like your guys' ideas about being established and all, but just remmember that there are guys like me that have been a member for a while but dont post that often. So dont make that rule that you need to have 110,001,102 posts to sell/part something out. I joined a supra forum once to sell a 1984 supra that i had, but because i didnt have 1,000 posts, i couldnt even try to sell it. O well there loss.
Turbo_JB

ORIGINAL: turbo_jb

I like your guys' ideas about being established and all, but just remmember that there are guys like me that have been a member for a while but dont post that often. So dont make that rule that you need to have 110,001,102 posts to sell/part something out. I joined a supra forum once to sell a 1984 supra that i had, but because i didnt have 1,000 posts, i couldnt even try to sell it. O well there loss.
Turbo_JB


I agree. I am parting out a bike right now and it was my first post. But I bet anyone buying parts from me on this forum would buy again from me with no problem. I think that would be stupid to put a posting limit. As far as the frames and stolen bikes, I understand where you are coming from. BUT, a thief could easily find a picture of the vin number from a different bike and post it up. It is not going to stop anyone in my opinion, people who don't care if parts are stolen will buy them either way.

Just me 2cents

Derek S

ORIGINAL: DerekS

I agree. I am parting out a bike right now and it was my first post. But I bet anyone buying parts from me on this forum would buy again from me with no problem. I think that would be stupid to put a posting limit.
Well that's great! You are an honest person...but how exactlyis it "stupid" to put a minimum post on would-be sellers?
Wouldn't you want to purchase something with the comfort of knowing the person you are dealing with is an established/ active member of the community?

I can pull up 5 threads right now that resulted in the buyer getting screwed by a new member who was selling stuff.....<thinking>....fairings come to mind....a seat comes to mind....let's see........what else.....I know a scumbag contacted me about a few items I was looking for and whaddya know, he hasn't been on in months! Hmmmm.....would I have been ripped off had I sent money? I'd say so.

As far as the frames and stolen bikes, I understand where you are coming from. BUT, a thief could easily find a picture of the vin number from a different bike and post it up.
Easily? How many people do you know can get a pic of a registered VIN (current, previous, etc)? What's the secret? Wait for Bike Week and just start grabbing pics of everyone's VIN? While the chance is present, it's highly unlikely this would occur.

It is not going to stop anyone in my opinion, people who don't care if parts are stolen will buy them either way.

Well, just knowing that I'm gonna sit back and do nothing about it?? WTF kinda approach is that?
At leastthe attempt ofdeterring this type of activitywhere everyone collectively does their part in preventing sales of this nature would exist, therefore, minimizing the impact of stolen goods.



You are absolutely correct it will never stop....but whywould any of us just lay down and let our **** get stolen and then sold back to us? I'll be God-damned if I'm not going to try and do my part to prevent the sale of stolen goods. I may not change the world but at least I can say I'm doing my part.

ORIGINAL: bergs
Well that's great! You are an honest person...but how exactlyis it "stupid" to put a minimum post on would-be sellers?
Wouldn't you want to purchase something with the comfort of knowing the person you are dealing with is an established/ active member of the community?

You can say that, but from a different view its a downfall. Would you want someone posting a bunch of stupid nonsense stuff just so they can sell items? I like this forum, but it is not as busy as some of theother forums I am on. If someone needs to sell something but doesn't want to wait a month or longer just to build up posts they will start postwhoring ever thread. Does that make them a more trustworthy person?


ORIGINAL: bergs
I can pull up 5 threads right now that resulted in the buyer getting screwed by a new member who was selling stuff.....<thinking>....fairings come to mind....a seat comes to mind....let's see........what else.....I know a scumbag contacted me about a few items I was looking for and whaddya know, he hasn't been on in months! Hmmmm.....would I have been ripped off had I sent money? I'd say so.

Everyone gets screwed over at some point. You can't just point your finger at all the new members. I am sure I can easily pull up 5 threads were someone got screwed over from someone else that has been posting for a while.

ORIGINAL: DerekS
As far as the frames and stolen bikes, I understand where you are coming from. BUT, a thief could easily find a picture of the vin number from a different bike and post it up. ORIGINAL: bergs


Easily? How many people do you know can get a pic of a registered VIN (current, previous, etc)? What's the secret? Wait for Bike Week and just start grabbing pics of everyone's VIN? While the chance is present, it's highly unlikely this would occur.


If someone wants to do it, they will get it done. That is all I am trying to say.

The post count thing is required by many sites because it makes sense. You shouldn't just be here to pawn things. If you want to be able to sell, you should have to contribute something. It's just that simple. Now, 1000 posts is a REALLY high level of deterrance, but I bet it is very effective at weeding out those who are only there to scam or only to sell items. It took me about six or seven months to get over 1000 posts. I understand some people don't post much, but that's not enough of a reason to say a site being proactive about sale safety is bad. As a newb, you should not have rights until you have earned them. I wouldn't mind seeing a post count, member ship length requirement, or a contribution requirement for frequent sellers along with the VIN picture on part outs. If these people really have these bikes and are legitimate, running outside to take a picture of the VIN should not be a problem. Will there be someone trying to scam? Of course, but you may significantly reduce that possibility with the other control methods.

Something I have made a point of doing, since we don't have i-trader points or the like, is adding the names of those who I have had dealings with to my signature. It's a simple way of telling others that these people are good to deal with. Doesn't take long to do and it shows up in every post I make.

ORIGINAL: DerekS
You can say that, but from a different view its a downfall. Would you want someone posting a bunch of stupid nonsense stuff just so they can sell items? I like this forum, but it is not as busy as some of theother forums I am on. If someone needs to sell something but doesn't want to wait a month or longer just to build up posts they will start postwhoring ever thread. Does that make them a more trustworthy person?
I'd think it would be obvious as to who's postwhoring and who's posting viable information.


Everyone gets screwed over at some point. You can't just point your finger at all the new members. I am sure I can easily pull up 5 threads were someone got screwed over from someone else that has been posting for a while.
After all these years on intraweb purchases I'm still batting 1000. Never been screwed over....never once in any online experience to date.
<looks outside to see bike and trailer being stolen>

I'm not pointing a finger at all the new members, just the ones that sign on only to, as sixhundredrr put it, pawn stuff.

For clarity, I'm not saying this to you personally to try and chase you off the forum...that's not my intent and I hope it's not coming across as that. I'm saying it as a blanket statement.

There area few online pawn shops...eBay and Craigs List are a good start....funny thing is there are more scammers on CL than I can shake a stick at.

With that, I'd like you to notice what CL does to prevent this. The answer is "not much". I'm not bashing CL, I'm using them as an example of how open-ended some sites are.

Forums are a good place to start to help minimize the transactions of stolen goods. They are a place where like-minded people gather, makes friendsand, in essence, protect one another.

ORIGINAL: DerekS

If someone wants to do it, they will get it done. That is all I am trying to say.



I hear ya and that's why we have eBay and such. My question is what is the community going to do to help minimize it? I don't mean just this community on the CBRForum,I mean the entire motorcyling community.
We, as individuals, have to do our parts tominimizegoods being stolen and thensold back to us from people that aren't like us....they don't haveour mindset or concept of "hard working people".
They are property-molesters. They make their money by ripping off people like you and I and think nothing of it to find a place to sell it.

I totally agree with Bergs, and everyone who agrees with him. And I think sixhundredRR makes a good point of putting good sellers/buyers in to his siggy.

Being the new member that I am, I understand the point about having a set amount of post before you can sell being bad. If I had some stuff I wanted to sell and I needed to get 50 more posts(or however many) that would be a little bit of a neusance. But honestly to me just by this post coming up I feel more confident if I wanted to buy something on here, knowing there are motorcycle enthusiasts who are determined to do what they can to prevent motorcycle theft, or profit from theft.

And of course Derek S is correct, if someone wants to part out a stolen bike they will almost definitely find a way. Making it harder for them to do it will help for sure.

In the end my .02 would be The VIN Idea is great but we all need to watch out for sketchy deals where it may be a hot bike, and if all we can do is say "this seems sketchy/might be stolen" in the post at least that could keep someone who isn't as aware from supporting a thief.

So I guess CBRForum does NOT have a moderator(s) due to the lack of feedback from my previous post who can enforce a new rule about pics/VIN#'s.

Also, Kawiforum has a separate thread for "Vendor experiences" which members there could post about other members who sold in there for + and - feedback. This could be better than putting your experience in your signature.

I can agree with the fact that there needs to be safeguards in place for posting bikes! Have i been scammed in the past online? Hell yeah most of us have at one point or another if you have been around since the dialup days! Have i ever had a bike stolen from me? YEP! Those of us who this has happened to can agree it sucks! You feel like you have been violated and most of us will continue to fight the best we can to save overselves and others who could be the next potential victim!!!!!

As for posting a pic i would recommend sending the VIN of any bike to one main person so you know who has your vin,and potentially personal info! Read further and you will understand why i will NEVER post a public pic of a VIN registered to me again!!!!

Alot of parters sooner or later hookup with someone with a dealers license who go to auctions, buy a few bikes and part them out. Perfectly legal?,yes!
Some guys make friends with storage yards who then buy the stuff sitting unclaimed after the yard owner puts in the appropriate paperwork and part it out. Perfectly legal? yes again!!!!
Problem you run into is if you go with your dealer buddy and its under his license he will not give you the paperwork as he is responsible for that bike unless he is going to "resell" it to you and make his profit.
Tow yards and such better at least give you a bill of sale,but most wont. It is up to you to go to your local P.D. BEFORE you take possession of the bike and ask nicely if they would run the VIN. Of course you will get the "Why does it matter to you?". Most level headed cops or those who even are on the bike scene will understand why and if you tell them you want it checked out before you buy it or even touch it they will most likely(ok sometimes) understand. If it pops up stolen then you know not to touch it but then you also have the opportunity to give them all info that you have on the scumbag!

I myself have used this method and it does work! It takes two seconds for law enforcement to get a response on there computer if its stolen or not! I have bought a few parts bikes without titles BUT made sure i had the VINS checked before i even picked it up or put money down.
What is a vin and what does it coincide with? The frame and if you work at a dealer you can check the vin against the serial number on the motor to see if its a match correct??? ANY other part on that bike have a vin? no! Most theives, especially if there established or been caught before know better than to sell a stolen frame or motor on the net, wayyyy to risky thanks to internet crimes divisions across the U.S.! ITS UP TO YOU TO WEED OUT THE BAD GUYS IN THE FORMS OF ASKING FOR VINS IF THEY ARE PARTING OUT THE WHOLE BIKE AND ALSO POSTING" THIS SOUNDS SKETCHY!" IN THE POSTS!!!!!

However , If i would sell anything regarding a vin, like a complete bike i would only send the pic directly to the requestor. As someone previously posted its too easy for some knucklehead to see your vin, download the pic to his computer and use it now for his unscrupulous reasons, either in the form of misrepresenting info or even other ways .I was a victim in the past on fleabay where i posted a bike for sale, posted a pic of the VIN (biiiiiiig no no!!!!) in my listing and after i sold the bike(locally since my reserve wasnt met), which was still in my name i was contacted by a guy who sent me a pic of A bike and claimed i sold it to him with no title. After contacting the guy who i sold it to i told him what happened and he said the title and bike are still in his possession ,and i verified that by paying him a visit! I told the guy who claimed he bought the bike from me to contact the police, which he did and told him to have his police department contact me with questions. Oh they sure did along with a visit from my police department to verify what was going on. I went with the officers to this guys house to inspect the bike i sold and my side panne